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Post by jb1069 on Oct 3, 2012 8:41:47 GMT -5
Timex, It is obvious you can't have a civil discussion without trying to make a demeaning comment towards someone. Surely you do not want to turn this into comments about you being a better dad than I? Do you really?
It also obvious in your agreement with Woody that this is truly a recruitment ploy. The more kids you get involved the more revenue that is generated for the state and to help the fight against the anti's. I have to say I am against that too. If we as adults cant find another way to fight the anti's than just buying youth season tags then I would say our tradition of hunting sports is in much worse jeopardy than we realize. My point is. If we continue to make everything easy and special for our youth we will miss the boat completely. It doesn't take trophy's for the losing team to teach them that this game is worth playing.
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Post by cambygsp on Oct 3, 2012 8:44:54 GMT -5
It's sad Timex, but alot of folks just worry about what they are goa see on their next huting trip, when it comes to hunting.
We heard all of this several years back when the state first adopted the youth season on deer. I personaly think its oe of the best things they have ever done for the sport of deer hunting.......kids REALLY get excited about THEIR youth season and it can light a fire in their belly for hunting for the rest of their lives.
My son who is now almost 20 had the privilage of huting 3 youth deer seasons and he just told me Monday while we were at deer camp "Dad those youth hunts are some of the best memories of deer hunting I have"
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Post by firstwd on Oct 3, 2012 8:57:07 GMT -5
"I find it ironic this guy's handle starts with "jb"....hmmm. Can you say bitter?" Just what do you find ironic? My name is Jim Behagg...Get it? I am not hiding behind some user name. Its just what I came up with when signing up for this forum. If there is something I am missing please clue me in. As far as being bitter you are way off, this whole discussion started because one man slightly misspoke about the youth season. His comments lead people to believe he blamed youth season for the death occurring over the weekend. At that point everyone felt the need to correct him. Where I messed up was not starting this as a whole new thread because even as "bitter" as you say I am I do not think for one minute youth season caused the death of this young man. From the facts I have read none of us know the whole story yet. Either way it is a terrible lose for his family. Timex, You say its sad to have the point of view that someone else has or for that matter mine. Care to explain? I have requested twice the benefits coming from youth season and so far only Woody has shared his views on that? I have shared mine. Please share yours. In my opinion, every benefit anyone can list about youth season I can list the exact same benefit for youths in regular season with the added benefit of teaching a child that they don't need a head start to make it great. That opening morning of gun season only comes once and that's why its special. Hunting and fishing are two of the very few sports in the world where we ask kids to compete with adults. If youth hunting is not needed to help get our future established then why do we need little league baseball or Pee Wee football? Why don't we just ask these players to jump right into the NFL or MLB? How about this for a thought? If not having youth only hunting privileges was working so well at recruiting our hunting future, then why have hunter numbers dropped so much over the years. In one of the regular publications I get (I'll have to find the article) they had a story on hunter number rising for the first time in several years. They contributed that rise to the efforts of state DNR's to include youth programs.
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Post by jb1069 on Oct 3, 2012 9:00:48 GMT -5
What is really sad is that you make personal speculations about people when they don't agree with you. So far each comment I have made has been my opinion on how I feel hunting with a youth should be handled and the benefits that can be had or missed out on. Each and every reply has simply been to get more people in the woods to preserve what you like doing. As I asked the gentleman yesterday, do you not think your son would still being hunting if it wasn't for those 3 youth seasons? I bet he would be. Simply because if it had not been an option you would have taken him during the regular season and those would be some of the best memories of his life. Im sure they are good memories but I bet the time you spent with him the rest of hunting season and the following year getting ready for the next season is what keeps him in the woods. Not just the 2 days he got to hunt on youth weekend.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2012 9:02:20 GMT -5
We teach the total deer camp experience on our youth hunt in Ind. I know for a fact, we helped create several life long hunters .
Next week, one of our sponsors is Derby City QDMA is doing a 31 kid youth hunt for milatary dependents. A few of these youngsters do not have a male parent to take them hunting. We provide that. Otherwise, they would never have an oppurtunity.
I find it really hard to understand how anyone could be against anything promoting youth involvement in any sport. Be it Tball or Scouting or hunting sports. Most sports reward particapation.
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Post by jb1069 on Oct 3, 2012 9:07:34 GMT -5
How are we asking them to compete with adults? Maybe I am missing something here but how is this a competition? If thats the case then you just confirm what I am saying. Your telling them the sooner they get out there the better the chance they have of killing one and winning over the next guy. Mother nature is the only competition we have in this game. Anything else is just ego.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2012 9:11:59 GMT -5
how many people are out in the woods on the opening day of firearms season compared to how many youths are out there during the youth hunt? numbers are probally 10 to 20 times greater opening of firearms season, maybe even more. sounds like a little more competing as you say for the same amount of deer.
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Post by Woody Williams on Oct 3, 2012 9:13:31 GMT -5
Actually hunting this early is not as easy as some think as the deer are not moving well and the woods is dense. Unless that youth is hunting a food plot their chance at a deer is less now than a week before gun season. But we wouldn't want to interfere with some of the bowhunters would we? Yes, youths can learn form dad during the regular season, IF dad takes them during HIS hunt. This weekend is about the youths and them only.. Hopefully dad will take them later too...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2012 9:15:20 GMT -5
A lot of hunting is controlled by peer pressure. Guys are competitve by nature. They want the biggest and best. Been like that since the caveman hunted for exsistance.. Whereas an adult mght set his goal as a 130 or a 8 point or whatever, most of these youngsters just want to be part of the hunt.
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Post by tynimiller on Oct 3, 2012 9:16:06 GMT -5
Timex brought up some great points, and they're true...I do feel youth seasons, youth license prices and such have definitely done good things for numbers...however I also feel some of what jb is saying is valid as well. As a matter of fact both sides are valid in the fact opinions are always valid to the owner of them to a degree.
JB it's true in a lot of cases the youth of this generation are so used to getting exceptions or special treatment it does raise a dependant generation and that "me-me" personality...however I feel with proper parenting that can and is overruled by good parents or mentors.
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Post by jb1069 on Oct 3, 2012 9:17:46 GMT -5
"I find it really hard to understand how anyone could be against anything promoting youth involvement in any sport. Be it Tball or Scouting or hunting sports. Most sports reward particapation."
Maybe you have missed my point all together. I am all for youth participation. I am just not for youth season. I think it sends the wrong message. I see more benefits of taking them during regular season.
And to compare what we do with tee-ball is really not the same. We are trying to teach a lifestyle, a tradition that at the end of the game you pull the trigger and kill something. And you feel good about it because that is what hunters do. Then we go home and eat the meat of our kill. Alittle more to it than putting on the costume and showing up at the check station with dad. I applaud each and everyone of you that has taken a child that doesnt have a father figure. Your exactly right, they may never have gotten the chance. My question is does it take youth season to do that? Does youth season make that any easier?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2012 9:20:54 GMT -5
the youth season is designed to get the kids out in a safer envirroment than the gung ho opening day of regular firearms season. its not any more special treatment than that. its more of a safty feature for them. if indeed you think its special treatment or an exception how about we move gun season before archery season. seems to me archery hunters are getting special treatment too. i mean you have over a month where the kids get 2 days.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2012 9:24:44 GMT -5
You said everybody on the team doesnt need a trophy or should get.one. They do in Tball.
Be sure to vote on the poll question
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Post by jb1069 on Oct 3, 2012 9:31:22 GMT -5
Woody, I couldnt agree with you more. This is probably the toughest time of the year to hunt. It is thick out there. That being said if this is truely about the youth and upping their chances to take a deer then why is youth season set up in the worst time possible? Why because as everyone one wants to point and think I am worried about some child taking the deer I have been watching it is them that dont want to share the heat of the rut with a youngster. They want that time of the year to themselves. So they take them early and get that out of the way and put a feather in their hat for being a super dad and go on to hunt when the woods open up and the deer really start moving.
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Post by Woody Williams on Oct 3, 2012 9:45:52 GMT -5
Woody, I couldnt agree with you more. This is probably the toughest time of the year to hunt. It is thick out there. That being said if this is truely about the youth and upping their chances to take a deer then why is youth season set up in the worst time possible? Why because as everyone one wants to point and think I am worried about some child taking the deer I have been watching it is them that dont want to share the heat of the rut with a youngster. They want that time of the year to themselves. So they take them early and get that out of the way and put a feather in their hat for being a super dad and go on to hunt when the woods open up and the deer really start moving. The reason that the youth season is where it is at was becasue of some organized hunting groups not wanting them in the early archery season. Anyone that is involved with kids and hunting wants to see them succeed. Now is not the best time to do it. For these mentors taking the kids out is not about getting the kids hunting out of the way early. It is the season that the DNR gave us..we HAVE to abide with that.
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Post by water63 on Oct 3, 2012 9:48:47 GMT -5
I agree with Woody this is a tough time of year to hunt. But when are you going to put the season in the weekend before gun season might work but then someone else will be unhappy. It is a vicious cycle. I am at the point in my hunting that I get a bigger thrill of watching my daughter hunt and seeing these young kids get one than I am about getting one myself. This did not happen in a youth season but two years ago I let a nice buck walk by because I knew the neighbor boy was hunting down the fence from me he got that deer. It scored just over 120" it hangs on his wall now. I feel proud of him for the harvest he made a great shot and was his first bow buck. That deer means more to me than some of my deer I shot. He knew that it came past me and asked why I didn't shoot it I simply told him I just didn't have a good shot but you got him that's what counts. These kids will remember those hunts forever just like we remember our first days out.
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Post by Woody Williams on Oct 3, 2012 9:51:30 GMT -5
Woody, I couldnt agree with you more. This is probably the toughest time of the year to hunt. It is thick out there. That being said if this is truely about the youth and upping their chances to take a deer then why is youth season set up in the worst time possible? Why because as everyone one wants to point and think I am worried about some child taking the deer I have been watching it is them that dont want to share the heat of the rut with a youngster. They want that time of the year to themselves. So they take them early and get that out of the way and put a feather in their hat for being a super dad and go on to hunt when the woods open up and the deer really start moving. The reason that the youth season is where it is at was becasue of some organized hunting groups not wanting them in the early archery season. Anyone that is involved with kids and hunting wants to see them succeed. Now is not the best time to do it. For these mentors taking the kids out is not about getting the kids hunting out of the way early. It is the season that the DNR gave us..we HAVE to abide with that. During the youth season administrative rules process on the youth season an officer of one of the hunting groups posted..
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Post by dbd870 on Oct 3, 2012 9:52:28 GMT -5
Actually hunting this early is not as easy as some think as the deer are not moving well and the woods is dense. Unless that youth is hunting a food plot their chance at a deer is less now than a week before gun season. But we wouldn't want to interfere with some of the bowhunters would we? Yes, youths can learn form dad during the regular season, IF dad takes them during HIS hunt. This weekend is about the youths and them only.. Hopefully dad will take them later too... Agreed.
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Post by Woody Williams on Oct 3, 2012 9:54:20 GMT -5
You are right water63
It would not matter where they place it, someone would be upset.
Getting kids into hunting and doing our best to make that hunt a positive experience way over rides any objections...at least to me.
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Post by jb1069 on Oct 3, 2012 9:56:57 GMT -5
"For these mentors taking the kids out is not about getting the kids hunting out of the way early. It is the season that the DNR gave us..we HAVE to abide with that."
Is there a law saying kids cant be taken during regular season? No..if you are a mentor or father figure you are one for life...not just two days.
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