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Post by greghopper on Nov 29, 2021 9:55:07 GMT -5
You got a special formula that shows how a 50% success rate or any rate is calculated? Do share.... Not sure how landowner and lifetime hunters are accounted for unless they check-in a Kill! Landowner and lifetime hunter's check-in around 35k last year. That’s why he posted “about”. The DNR does a lot of guesstimating Yeah “about” is just a guess....I didn't think there was an actual formula! Personally... I have never seen a DNR statement on a success rate.
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Post by Woody Williams on Nov 29, 2021 9:57:34 GMT -5
Boonechaser,
I’d say that is pretty well average for bowhunters. I’d say that most bowhunters are not true archers but only see a bow as a means to hunt an extended season.
No doubt some are in love with archery and shoot a lot of arrows but most don’t.
Most bowhunters, that I know, pick up their compound from where it was hanging since last season, dust it off, shoot enough arrows to determine its in and go hunting.
Shooting a compound is like riding a bicycle. You might get a little rusty, but you don’t forget how.
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Post by greghopper on Nov 29, 2021 9:59:46 GMT -5
How would that work?? Honor system?? No way to track as most wouldn't report IMO. It would have to be the honor system, but for guided hunts that would be easy, and as much as people love to post stuff on social media I'm sure that many people would either think about posting or think about their shot first. A person posting "I shot a giant and we are going to look for it in the morning" would be easy to check for the DNR if they wanted to follow up on it. There's a guy here in the area that has said he's shot and lost 5 deer this year so far, both with archery equipment and during firearm season. One was a buck in the 160 class and another was one in the 150 class. If the Deer doesn't actually die not sure why a tag should be lost....Slippy slope! IMO
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Post by greghopper on Nov 29, 2021 10:13:59 GMT -5
I'd love to see the current ML season run concurrent with Archery season. On another note, firstwd, how do I get a thought for a new regulation to the correct people? I would like to propose a regulation that says if you draw blood you have to count that animal towards your daily/season bag limit. Petition for Rule Change here..... www.in.gov/legislative/iac/20170531-IR-312170268NRA.xml.pdfThat is the correct way to change or add a NEW rule .
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Post by esshup on Nov 29, 2021 10:15:54 GMT -5
It would have to be the honor system, but for guided hunts that would be easy, and as much as people love to post stuff on social media I'm sure that many people would either think about posting or think about their shot first. A person posting "I shot a giant and we are going to look for it in the morning" would be easy to check for the DNR if they wanted to follow up on it. There's a guy here in the area that has said he's shot and lost 5 deer this year so far, both with archery equipment and during firearm season. One was a buck in the 160 class and another was one in the 150 class. If the Deer doesn't actually die not sure why a tag should be lost....Slippy slope! IMO Slippery or not, why wound at all? I can see a whoops once in a while, but face it, how many hunters have one of those a year? The percentage is very low I'll bet. BUT the idiots that take low percentage shots, don't bother sighting in their weapons, don't practice, etc. are the ones that would be affected the most and they should be.
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Post by titanium700 on Nov 29, 2021 10:28:05 GMT -5
Hunter success rate is already about 50% and the vast majority of hunters only take one deer. So unless you just want less hunters in the field the annual harvest will remain fairly steady. You got a special formula that shows how a 50% success rate or any rate is calculated? Do share.... Not sure how landowner and lifetime hunters are accounted for unless they check-in a Kill! Landowner and lifetime hunter's check-in around 35k last year. We have to check in just the same as everyone else. I’m both. Lifetime license and a landowner. I do both. There is a provision on the check-in for land ownership.
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Post by firstwd on Nov 29, 2021 10:44:20 GMT -5
That’s why he posted “about”. The DNR does a lot of guesstimating Yeah “about” is just a guess....I didn't think there was an actual formula! Personally... I have never seen at DNR statement on a success rate. That about 50% guess has been used by the DNR based on license sales versus harvest numbers.
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Post by Woody Williams on Nov 29, 2021 11:03:00 GMT -5
In order to get a good success percentage the DNR needs to know how many hunters are out there hunting. That’s pretty tough to do with lifetime license holders, landowners, military and any other license exempt hunters. That is an unknown. I’m sure the DNR has some kind of educated guess.
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Post by Woody Williams on Nov 29, 2021 11:05:49 GMT -5
BTW - most of our hunting laws are on the “honor system”.
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Post by greghopper on Nov 29, 2021 11:20:17 GMT -5
In order to get a good success percentage the DNR needs to know how many hunters are out there hunting. That’s pretty tough to do with lifetime license holders, landowners, military and any other license exempt hunters. That is an unknown. I’m sure the DNR has some kind of educated guess. I agree ...But have you ever seen their "educated guess" made public? I personally hadn't then start looking after seeing FW post. I did find average success rate of deer hunters in US from NDA. www.deerassociation.com/which-state-has-the-most-successful-hunters/#:~:text=In%20the%20U.S.%2C%20an%20average%20of%2048%20percent,at%20least%20one%20more%20deer%20during%20the%20season.
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Post by boonechaser on Nov 29, 2021 11:28:50 GMT -5
Boonechaser, I’d say that is pretty well average for bowhunters. I’d say that most bowhunters are not true archers but only see a bow as a means to hunt an extended season. No doubt some are in love with archery and shoot a lot of arrows but most don’t. Most bowhunters, that I know, pick up their compound from where it was hanging since last season, dust it off, shoot enough arrows to determine its in and go hunting. Shooting a compound is like riding a bicycle. You might get a little rusty, but you don’t forget how. AGREED.. For me anymore, the more I shoot the worse I get. LOL... I'm still shooting 70 lbs and 60% let off which is mainly the reason. Plan on buying a new bow in offseason with more let off which should help.
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Post by tynimiller on Nov 29, 2021 11:29:55 GMT -5
How would that work?? Honor system?? No way to track as most wouldn't report IMO. It would have to be the honor system, but for guided hunts that would be easy, and as much as people love to post stuff on social media I'm sure that many people would either think about posting or think about their shot first. A person posting "I shot a giant and we are going to look for it in the morning" would be easy to check for the DNR if they wanted to follow up on it. There's a guy here in the area that has said he's shot and lost 5 deer this year so far, both with archery equipment and during firearm season. One was a buck in the 160 class and another was one in the 150 class. If the Deer doesn't actually die not sure why a tag should be lost....Slippy slope! IMO Slippery or not, why wound at all? I can see a whoops once in a while, but face it, how many hunters have one of those a year? The percentage is very low I'll bet. BUT the idiots that take low percentage shots, don't bother sighting in their weapons, don't practice, etc. are the ones that would be affected the most and they should be. The biggest issue is whenever ANY ethical minded hunter attempts to educate or explain to a hunter why their shot should have never happened, folks literally blast you as the one with the problem. Until the hunting community makes folks feel bad for "taking a shot" and not "taking the right shot" it will only continue to get worse. I mean excellent example was last year some idiot came onto social media bragging about a buck he harvested, the dude shot three or four rows deep through corn, admitting he couldn't see anything but the deers eyes, part of the head and the tail and back leg. He guesstimated where the kill zone should be and took his chance because it was "now or never". I came in and commented in short (was much longer and polite but blunt) congratulations but the shot should have never been taken. I got attacked and eventually the admins actually silenced me in the group for two weeks....not the ignorant fool that was broadcasting such a shot choice to any and all that could see the post (youths, young and inexperienced hunters). Until the day comes the hunting community stops the "stand with all hunters" blindly BS, things will only slowly continue to erode.
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Post by greghopper on Nov 29, 2021 12:03:31 GMT -5
Hunting ethics can very among different Hunters....Taking Head shots or long range shots usually find some divided IMO
Common sense does need to happen more often for sure IMO
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Post by boonechaser on Nov 29, 2021 12:20:40 GMT -5
Hunting ethics can very among different Hunters....Taking Head shots or long range shots usually find some divided IMO Common sense does need to happen more often for sure IMO Broadside or quartering away are only 2 shots I take with bow and can add quatering too with gun. No running shots, no head shots and no straight on shots or obstructive shots for me regardless of weapon. I am sure these things are preached in hunter education classes but falls on deaf ears by some. HUNTING ETHICS. You either have them or you don't.
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Post by span870 on Nov 29, 2021 12:30:27 GMT -5
Really want a season for them. Yes, spelling the name wrong to make us feel like rednecks isnt helping, either. Take a pill, dude. It's actually an inside joke I share with Woody. Zero to do with anyone on here or anyone's comments With that said it's pointed to those that think bobcats cause an even blip on the radar on predation of deer. Any state that doesn't hold an agenda that has done any study showed nothing. Somehow our indiana bobcats have become super predators and are decimating the population. You want to shoot a Bobcat, just say it but don't pin anything but the shrinking population of rodents on them because the data isn't there. Zero issue with them having a season and if they allow dogs I'll be the first in line buying big hounds.
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Post by tynimiller on Nov 29, 2021 12:36:58 GMT -5
Yes, spelling the name wrong to make us feel like rednecks isnt helping, either. Take a pill, dude. It's actually an inside joke I share with Woody. With that said it's pointed to those that think bobcats cause an even blip on the radar on predation of deer. Any state that doesn't hold an agenda that has done any study showed nothing. Somehow our indiana bobcats have become super predators and are decimating the population. You want to shoot a Bobcat, just say it but don't pin anything but the shrinking population of rodents on them because the data isn't there. Zero issue with them having a season and if they allow dogs I'll be the first in line buying big hounds. I'd venture to bet domesticated dogs have killed more deer in a year than bobcats.
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Post by span870 on Nov 29, 2021 12:43:30 GMT -5
It's actually an inside joke I share with Woody. With that said it's pointed to those that think bobcats cause an even blip on the radar on predation of deer. Any state that doesn't hold an agenda that has done any study showed nothing. Somehow our indiana bobcats have become super predators and are decimating the population. You want to shoot a Bobcat, just say it but don't pin anything but the shrinking population of rodents on them because the data isn't there. Zero issue with them having a season and if they allow dogs I'll be the first in line buying big hounds. I'd venture to bet domesticated dogs have killed more deer in a year than bobcats. We don't always agree or see eye to eye but I'd imagine you are correct. I'd wager that a single family of coons or possums will kill more turkeys in one year than all cats in Indiana combined for same year.
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Post by greghopper on Nov 29, 2021 12:48:27 GMT -5
Hunting ethics can very among different Hunters....Taking Head shots or long range shots usually find some divided IMO Common sense does need to happen more often for sure IMO Broadside or quartering away are only 2 shots I take with bow and can add quatering too with gun. No running shots, no head shots and no straight on shots or obstructive shots for me regardless of weapon. I am sure these things are preached in hunter education classes but falls on deaf ears by some. HUNTING ETHICS. You either have them or you don't. I agree.... But I also don't believe the list you posted is a complete Industry standard, definitely a good guideline.
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Post by sculver7 on Nov 29, 2021 12:54:08 GMT -5
I'd like to add my thoughts as I am just now seeing this discussion for the first time.
1. Someone posted earlier in the thread that less and less people are hunting each year. I have heard this before and I do not know if this is true or not. Maybe someone can give me the statistics for Indiana that back this up. Personally, I have seen the number of people hunting going up drastically in my area. That could just be annecdotal to my area though. Just looking for the actual stats on this.
2. I think that the governing authorities that set our deer regulations get quite a bit right, but still have a decent amount that they get wrong. The way public land properties are managed is absolutely abysmal, at least in my area. Rules are not enforced even when provided with license plate numbers, pictures, etc. of people breaking said rules. The more people see rules being broken, the more likely more people are to break rules and then you end up with a property/deer herd being destroyed because there is no rule of law on the property. This has exponentially gotten worse over the last 3 years.
3. Before I say this I have to post this disclaimer: I have absolutely no issue with crossbows. I even have one due to an injury one year that caused me to not be able to use a vertical bow. That being said, a vertical bow and a crossbow are not the same thing and I wonder if some thought should be put to regulating them differently. Now, to give context, from late winter/early spring (typically March), I am shooting my bow 60-80 arrows each session 2-3 days a week. I practice out to 80 yards and would take a shot at a deer out to 50. I have killed a deer at 51 yards with my vertical bow. I know that the majority of people using a vertical bow do not do anywhere near this much shooting, but this plays into my thoughts on this. The problem of weapon proficiency is not witht his weapon; it is with the person using the weapon. I think this statement rings true: a properly-sighted in gun is easier to shoot with less practice than a properly-sighted crossbow out to farther distances. A properly-sighted crossbow is DRASTICALLY easier to shoot profficiently than a vertical bow, especially out to further distances. And when you start talking about trad bows (recurve and longbow) things get exponentially harder as well. A vertical bow and a crossbow are not the same as far as ease of use. That being said, the bigger issue is that people don't take the time to become profficient with the weapon they decide to use across ALL WEAPON TYPES.
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Post by span870 on Nov 29, 2021 13:11:01 GMT -5
I'd like to add my thoughts as I am just now seeing this discussion for the first time. 1. Someone posted earlier in the thread that less and less people are hunting each year. I have heard this before and I do not know if this is true or not. Maybe someone can give me the statistics for Indiana that back this up. Personally, I have seen the number of people hunting going up drastically in my area. That could just be annecdotal to my area though. Just looking for the actual stats on this. 2. I think that the governing authorities that set our deer regulations get quite a bit right, but still have a decent amount that they get wrong. The way public land properties are managed is absolutely abysmal, at least in my area. Rules are not enforced even when provided with license plate numbers, pictures, etc. of people breaking said rules. The more people see rules being broken, the more likely more people are to break rules and then you end up with a property/deer herd being destroyed because there is no rule of law on the property. This has exponentially gotten worse over the last 3 years. 3. Before I say this I have to post this disclaimer: I have absolutely no issue with crossbows. I even have one due to an injury one year that caused me to not be able to use a vertical bow. That being said, a vertical bow and a crossbow are not the same thing and I wonder if some thought should be put to regulating them differently. Now, to give context, from late winter/early spring (typically March), I am shooting my bow 60-80 arrows each session 2-3 days a week. I practice out to 80 yards and would take a shot at a deer out to 50. I have killed a deer at 51 yards with my vertical bow. I know that the majority of people using a vertical bow do not do anywhere near this much shooting, but this plays into my thoughts on this. The problem of weapon proficiency is not witht his weapon; it is with the person using the weapon. I think this statement rings true: a properly-sighted in gun is easier to shoot with less practice than a properly-sighted crossbow out to farther distances. A properly-sighted crossbow is DRASTICALLY easier to shoot profficiently than a vertical bow, especially out to further distances. And when you start talking about trad bows (recurve and longbow) things get exponentially harder as well. A vertical bow and a crossbow are not the same as far as ease of use. That being said, the bigger issue is that people don't take the time to become profficient with the weapon they decide to use across ALL WEAPON TYPES. I've hunted just about every wma in the state. Glendale f&w is the gold standard. Everyone else is a joke. 100% agree. They manage for everything and not just a single thing
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