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Post by trapperdave on Jul 31, 2008 8:58:16 GMT -5
think it has a little more to do with shooting at deer with firearms before early archery, which could produce the same results as depridation. Regardless, it is for the youth and a good reason to compromise on both sides, which has been done. that makes no sense to me at all.
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Post by larryhagmansliver on Jul 31, 2008 17:03:49 GMT -5
I'm still waiting for one of the opposed to give his or her reason. I hope it won't be any one of the following because that would be lame:
1. Kids need to learn to appreciate the hunt and not be taught to hunt "trophies" at an early age. 2. We need to control the does and this is one more tool for it. 3. Kids have their whole life to hunt for big bucks. What if they kill a big one now and won't ever have the chance to better it. 4. You need to hunt for a few years to deserve to shoot a buck. In a sense pay your dues. 5. The kids will shoot all the big bucks so we won't have any to go after. 6. If a kids sees a buck, he or she may take an unethical shot at it just for the chance of getting one. 7. That's my buck that I have been watching all summer long and some kid shouldn't be allowed to shoot it before I get a chance at him. 8. I would really like to come up with 10 bad reason why kids shouldn't be allowed to shoot bucks but can't think of any more. Do you have any? Do any of the opposed want to add their legit reason?
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Post by jkd on Jul 31, 2008 17:58:04 GMT -5
I support the either sex option...
Having said that, the reasons I heard last couple of years for the original version of the rule were (1) enforcement division concern regarding adults poaching bucks with firearms and tagging as youth harvested, and (2) compromise relative to those bowhunters who were concerned about prime bucks being taken prior to early archery... not saying I agree with either viewpoint, just reporting what I heard...
My 14 y.o. is getting ready for his 3rd youth deer hunt (he's 1 for 2 so far), and has said he could see it either way, as the rule was the rule... if it opened up to either sex and he saw a buck, he may or may not take the shot, as he's experienced enough now that he wants to let the little ones walk...
Remember too that landowners can restrict youth hunters to antlerless only if that's what they want done on private ground, so a rules change would only be mandatory on public hunting areas.
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dsg69
Full Member
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Post by dsg69 on Jul 31, 2008 19:39:31 GMT -5
This poll looks good. I hope everyone thinks like this and it gets changed to either sex. Or we could please some people and go to using spears and rocks . My bad that would put out the 300+ fps bows. Don,t take me wrong I love to bow hunt. No one has tried to put a limit on bow speed so lets leave the PCR's alone and move on in a forward path and not try to go backwards. Lets hope they change this to either sex. Then in 4 years do away with the OBR .
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Post by indianaboy on Jul 31, 2008 23:14:58 GMT -5
I support the fact that youth should be able to shoot either/ or. But very tentively because someone out there will ruin it for everyone when the parent shoots the buck instead of the kid. That is why it wasnt made that way in the first place. IMO I dont want to offend anyone on here but there are a lot of violators out there whether you want to believe it or not. They will be the ones that mess this up and probably cause this to not happen. If I knew without a doubt this stuff wouldnt happen I would strongly support it.
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Post by indianaboy on Jul 31, 2008 23:23:42 GMT -5
This poll looks good. I hope everyone thinks like this and it gets changed to either sex. Or we could please some people and go to using spears and rocks . My bad that would put out the 300+ fps bows. Don,t take me wrong I love to bow hunt. No one has tried to put a limit on bow speed so lets leave the PCR's alone and move on in a forward path and not try to go backwards. Lets hope they change this to either sex. Then in 4 years do away with the OBR . OBR ISNT GOING ANYWHERE Must have missed the PCR conversation. DOnt see anything wrong with them. If you are going to bring up the technology improvements of bows what about MLs.
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 1, 2008 2:10:27 GMT -5
My 14 y.o. is getting ready for his 3rd youth deer hunt (he's 1 for 2 so far), and has said he could see it either way, as the rule was the rule... if it opened up to either sex and he saw a buck, he may or may not take the shot, as he's experienced enough now that he wants to let the little ones walk... Remember too that landowners can restrict youth hunters to antlerless only if that's what they want done on private ground, so a rules change would only be mandatory on public hunting areas. That sounds like my son! Landowners have always had the right to set certian restrictions on their land, if you don't like the restrictions, hunt somewhere else. I know of one landowner who allows youths to hunt during the youth hunt, he has stated that he don't want the kids shooting just any antlerless deer, he wants them to hunt for a mature doe......no buttons and no fawns. And that perfectly fine.....because he owns the land he sets the rules!
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 1, 2008 5:07:03 GMT -5
So far about 86% percent favor allowing a either sex youth deer season.
Prior to the youth hunt I don't remember support for a youth hunt being that high, I know we did several polls on it but 86% is pretty darn high.
Anyone have any idea where this survey question is going, is there a rules process comming up or they just gonna do another emergency rule?
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Post by jackc99 on Aug 1, 2008 7:31:01 GMT -5
Most likely going through the full administrative rule process. That way it will be a permanent change as the emergency rules are only effective for a year and this is not an emergency.
Jack
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Post by trapperdave on Aug 1, 2008 8:28:03 GMT -5
What are the reasons for the opposition?? Greed
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Post by Woody Williams on Aug 1, 2008 12:28:02 GMT -5
Guys,
Let's be careful.
Automatically assigning reasons (using the big brush) to the other side in a debate can be wrong.
I know that this directed at the other side in general but 8 members on here voted against allowing either sex and could take some comments personal.
They don't care to divulge why they voted against it and that is OK.
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Post by Woody Williams on Aug 1, 2008 12:30:28 GMT -5
Most likely going through the full administrative rule process. That way it will be a permanent change as the emergency rules are only effective for a year and this is not an emergency. Jack ....and it wont happen this year. Taking either sex for the youth hunt that is.
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Post by West28 on Aug 1, 2008 13:16:33 GMT -5
I agree, definitely support and I would love to hear the reasons behind the opposition.
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Post by mbogo on Aug 1, 2008 13:26:58 GMT -5
Strongly support!
Yes, there are plenty of violators around but how exactly is a rule preventing kids from taking a buck in the youth season supposed to stop an adult that has already decided to take a buck illegally? Rules only deter those that are inclined to follow the rules in the first place.
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Post by larryhagmansliver on Aug 1, 2008 15:27:59 GMT -5
I think Fowlhunter had a good legit point included in his reply for the opposed view. What if you had a hunt planned for your kid where both of you were going to travel a couple hours. Your kids ends up shooting a buck close to home during the youth season and doesn't qualify to shoot a buck during your trip. Now he or she might not want to go and ruin the trip for the two of you. I really think that is legit. I still don't agree with it, but I could see the point.
Larry
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Post by fowlhunter on Aug 1, 2008 15:54:20 GMT -5
Larry,
Just to clarify l am 100 % for the youth being able to kill a buck. My first post was Joe Bacon's post cut and pasted from hoosierhunting.
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dsg69
Full Member
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Post by dsg69 on Aug 1, 2008 16:25:38 GMT -5
Indianaboy don't take me wrong I love new bows and MLs. My point is why try to stop any one from hunting the way they want to? If some one does not like a PCR , ML , X-bow they don't have to use one. If some one only wants to kill one buck than only kill one. Don't mess it up for the rest of us. I killed just as big if not bigger bucks before the OBR ,and that was 2 a year one with bow than one with gun. "That was the good old days!!"
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Post by pettitsoutdoor on Aug 1, 2008 17:35:33 GMT -5
I think if a parent didn't want to mess a hunt up they had planned later in the year by letting their kid shoot a buck, then the parent should set that restriction, not the state. That IMO is a very weak argument for not letting any youth in the entire state not shoot a buck, because it "Might" mess up someones plans?
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 1, 2008 18:57:12 GMT -5
I think Fowlhunter had a good legit point included in his reply for the opposed view. What if you had a hunt planned for your kid where both of you were going to travel a couple hours. Your kids ends up shooting a buck close to home during the youth season and doesn't qualify to shoot a buck during your trip. Now he or she might not want to go and ruin the trip for the two of you. I really think that is legit. I still don't agree with it, but I could see the point. Larry Come on, we are talking kids.........
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Post by huxbux on Aug 1, 2008 20:40:30 GMT -5
I have to strongly support. Due to other commitments my grandson didn't get a lot of hunting time and had only one shot on a deer all season. It was during youth weekend and he had to let a nice 1 1/2 year old buck walk by at 35 yds.
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