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Post by JohnSmiles on Apr 12, 2007 18:25:54 GMT -5
One more time... EASY GUYS! Hey, Easy is my middle name Woody. NP.
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Post by Old Ironsights on Apr 12, 2007 18:37:42 GMT -5
I cant see banning the handguns either .... and I dont think they open the door for HPR's. While I find the choice of an HPR caliber in a single shot or 3-shot bolt handgun imprudent, I also agree with your assessment for 3 reasons: 1) There is only a relatively small fraternity of those who use these. 2) Because those firearms have a longer learning curve, that small fraternity is, in large, more dedicated in their practice and precice in their shooting skills. 3) Those firearms have a low rate of fire - i.e. one is not likely to miss twice with one, lessening the danger envelope. 4) There is an established track record of their safe use, largely because of points 1-3. The probem with HPRs come in when people try to shoot across open fields - literally at targets at the feet of stands in the distant woodlot. With Slugs, "normal" muzzies and PCRs such attempts would be fruitless - and all but the most slobish realize it. But for an HPR, it is not out of line to take such a shot - and thereby endangers everyone in the distant woodlot. The same problems apply with HPR handguns, but I believe points 1-3 have mitigated that to the point of being a near non issue.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2007 18:39:55 GMT -5
MZ is a longer range firearm than a pistol in the hands of a average hunter. The absence of a shoulder stock and lower power optics and long eye relief scopes make the rifle better. The indians had a saying that is true still today. When a man with a rifle meets a man with a pistol, the man with a pistol is a dead man. Rifles are longer, even a front loading one.
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Post by mbogo on Apr 13, 2007 11:30:19 GMT -5
No, neither. Your original question was about high powered RIFLES and since rifles are long guns, I was speaking only of long guns in my reply. HPPs are a different matter and not even relevant to the discussion of long arms.
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Post by swilk on Apr 13, 2007 11:32:45 GMT -5
Thank you for the clarification.
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Post by indianahick on Apr 13, 2007 13:47:47 GMT -5
Swilk am on page 5. No I did not go back and read any of your old posts. May haps I should have said I believe I read or I think you said. Yes I have also seen your recants. As for the guy that shot a 6 pointer and then complains. I ask him did you see any other or larger bucks in your area? How many times did you go out? If his answer is that is the only buck that I saw and I only went out a couple of times I put him down as a complainer and forget him. He did not put in his time and now he is jealous. Personally I like my bucks to weigh in from 175 to 210 lbs. as they taste better. As for does I try to get the biggest doe in a group. That is if I get to see anything.
Okay now Yes I am still for crossbows for the over 50 crowd. My personal opinion of a crossbow is that they are heavy, awkward, hard to arm and not really a good weapon for most handicapped individual. Yes I am for PCR's and not HPR's. But that is from what I personally see as a safety factor due to habitation. Oh and sometimes I just argue the other side just to have some fun but then my heart is not really in it.
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Post by swilk on Apr 13, 2007 17:28:59 GMT -5
Not vastly different than I. Quite close actually.
The guy shooting the 6 pointer was a rhetorical question ..... in my situation there is no real answer. Smile and listen is all you can really do and still maintain the friendship.
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Post by hunter480 on Apr 13, 2007 19:46:15 GMT -5
hunter480: I only continue spinning what others start in motion. The word "opportunity" is very often spoken here ...... I just choose to push the spinning top back in the direction it came from. Im not afraid of loosing my credibility, but thank you for the concern. I suppose my "sadistic" to use the words of another, fun is over. My point is proven. Tell yourself whatever you have to I suppose, but you`ve proven NO point with this thread. Not about HPR`s or the hunters at this board at least-you`ve made baseless statements about people-they confuse facts, etc, but that is nothing more than your opinion, which is fine to have, but maybe not in such a rude manner. I wonder if anyone who has been a part of this discussion has any idea what you were trying to do, or what you THINK you`ve "proven", but all I`ve seen is a gleeful jabbing at people.
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Post by lugnutz on Apr 13, 2007 22:28:56 GMT -5
And who would of thought 5 years ago that, PCR would be legalized here in Indiana? Why not think the same thing with HPR's?
I find it more difficult to fire more than one shot a deer with a HPR. I would think the average hunter will not have the skills to find a running deer in his scope to take crazy, wild shots, Like you can with a Shotgun, Handgun, or Pistol.
If it were up to me, i'd make MODERN Firearm season a single shot weapon. And make any weapon, as long as its a single shot.
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Post by JohnSmiles on Apr 13, 2007 23:05:00 GMT -5
And who would of thought 5 years ago that, PCR would be legalized here in Indiana? Why not think the same thing with HPR's? I find it more difficult to fire more than one shot a deer with a HPR. I would think the average hunter will not have the skills to find a running deer in his scope to take crazy, wild shots, Like you can with a Shotgun, Handgun, or Pistol. If it were up to me, i'd make MODERN Firearm season a single shot weapon. And make any weapon, as long as its a single shot. I myself would have supported it 20 years ago. I am surprised it finally came up for a vote, as common sense laws have in the past been a rare and elusive thing.
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Post by dbd870 on Apr 14, 2007 1:59:34 GMT -5
Because they have clearly and always stated it is their position to only allow short and medium range weapons. PCR's fall in there HPR's do not. That position has never changed, I can't imagine it would now or in the future. I see no need to change the current regulation on the number of rounds; the sky isn't going to fall people.
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Post by tmarsh83 on Apr 14, 2007 9:15:03 GMT -5
They are also inconsistant. Hand cannons are neither short, or medium range. They are a long range HPR with a shortened barrel and without a stock.
Until those are removed from the legal firearms list, this whole load of guano that keeps getthing thrown around about Indiana's "dedication to being a short to medium range" state is total, 100% cornfed, BS.
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Post by drs on Apr 14, 2007 10:05:23 GMT -5
They are also inconsistant. Hand cannons are neither short, or medium range. They are a long range HPR with a shortened barrel and without a stock. Until those are removed from the legal firearms list, this whole load of guano that keeps getting thrown around about Indiana's "dedication to being a short to medium range" state is total, 100% cornfed, BS. Pistol, that fire high-powered rifle round have nothing to do with the issue of PCR which fire short-range ammo. The two are completely different animals.
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Post by lugnutz on Apr 14, 2007 10:55:37 GMT -5
They are also inconsistant. Hand cannons are neither short, or medium range. They are a long range HPR with a shortened barrel and without a stock. Until those are removed from the legal firearms list, this whole load of guano that keeps getting thrown around about Indiana's "dedication to being a short to medium range" state is total, 100% cornfed, BS. I believe tmarsh is talking HPP not PCRS. HPP's are exactly as he described them to be. Pistol, that fire high-powered rifle round have nothing to do with the issue of PCR which fire short-range ammo. The two are completely different animals.
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Post by swilk on Apr 14, 2007 12:30:44 GMT -5
They are also inconsistant. Hand cannons are neither short, or medium range. They are a long range HPR with a shortened barrel and without a stock. Until those are removed from the legal firearms list, this whole load of guano that keeps getthing thrown around about Indiana's "dedication to being a short to medium range" state is total, 100% cornfed, BS. Yep.
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Post by dbd870 on Apr 16, 2007 4:28:24 GMT -5
My undersanding is that the pistols got by them and once it was there - believe what you like about it, I'd be very suprised if they' let it happen again..............anyway this thread was started just to see how people who supported PCR's would respond, and that was obvious when it was posted. As far as the HPR objection it's nothing more than the anti PCR's setting up a straw man and knocking him down, as they have no real point to stand on it's just personal preference. Don't bother restating it's the same for the pro side, that's already been covered. This all is just being rehashed over and over; it is going nowhere. There is nothing new in this thread that we all haven't stated before.
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Post by indianahick on Apr 16, 2007 10:06:18 GMT -5
I would have no problem with the removal of the High Power Hand guns after the passage of the PCR.
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Post by tmarsh83 on Apr 16, 2007 17:18:48 GMT -5
They are also inconsistant. Hand cannons are neither short, or medium range. They are a long range HPR with a shortened barrel and without a stock. Until those are removed from the legal firearms list, this whole load of guano that keeps getting thrown around about Indiana's "dedication to being a short to medium range" state is total, 100% cornfed, BS. Pistol, that fire high-powered rifle round have nothing to do with the issue of PCR which fire short-range ammo. The two are completely different animals. David, this is titled, HPR's in Indiana. Those are High Powered Rifles. PCR's have nothing to do with HPR's. My comments were fully in line with the discussion that was taking place.
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Post by drs on Apr 17, 2007 7:04:28 GMT -5
Pistol, that fire high-powered rifle round have nothing to do with the issue of PCR which fire short-range ammo. The two are completely different animals. David, this is titled, HPR's in Indiana. Those are High Powered Rifles. PCR's have nothing to do with HPR's. My comments were fully in line with the discussion that was taking place. You and I have nothing to discuss on this issue. We must agree to disagree.
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Post by indianahick on Apr 17, 2007 13:50:58 GMT -5
Handguns (so called because of shorter barrels and no shoulder stock) that fire HPR ammunition are different than rifles that fire HPR ammunition. Maybe instead of rifles that shoot Pistol Cartridge ammunition after passage we should work to get the overall hand gun legislation to say that handguns must shoot ammunition of only these calibers and specify calibers that are standard hand gun ammunition type not HPR that has had a hand cannon modified to shoot it. Starting at 357 and going up to 44 mag or maybe even 50 at the utmost.
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