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Post by boonechaser on Dec 20, 2022 19:45:45 GMT -5
I say restrict then gun hunters to 4 days max... You better hope it’s not put up to a vote who’s season gets shortened.. The last time that shorten gun season was tried the “orange army” rose up in mass and shut it down. I am primarily a bowhunter, but don't support shortening firearms season, "IF" anything move archery back to old Oct.15th start date. Archery has 3 months to hunt currently. (It's a fact that majority of hunter's hunt with multiple weapon's.) Always the group with most wanting more.... lol
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Post by lawrencecountyhunter on Dec 20, 2022 19:49:05 GMT -5
I still shoot my compounds to stay halfway proficient so I can hunt states where crossbows aren't legal. I use mine a little bit around here, but it's been mostly crossbow for the last 3-4 years.
If crossbows were legal across the board, I'd probably forget all about my compound bows.
I like to hunt, not spend hundreds of hours shooting. I have to practice quite a bit to stay decent with a compound. It really starts to seem like work. I feel like just a few sessions with the crossbow before season gets me ethically proficient at reasonable ranges.
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Post by Woody Williams on Dec 20, 2022 19:56:40 GMT -5
You better hope it’s not put up to a vote who’s season gets shortened.. The last time that shorten gun season was tried the “orange army” rose up in mass and shut it down. I am primarily a bowhunter, but don't support shortening firearms season, "IF" anything move archery back to old Oct.15th start date. Archery has 3 months to hunt currently. (It's a fact that majority of hunter's hunt with multiple weapon's.) Always the group with most wanting more.... lol I wasn’t in the stand the whole month of October. I killed my buck my third hunt in November.
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Post by MuzzleLoader on Dec 20, 2022 20:12:31 GMT -5
Quit bow hunting several years ago. Don’t wanna put hours into practicing, not fun for me. Hunt very little with crossbow. Weather just to warm in October and early November.
Enjoy the colder and nasty weather in December. Miss the late season, would like to hunt over Christmas with a rifle or muzzle loader again.
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Post by greghopper on Dec 21, 2022 5:12:28 GMT -5
Yeah...not sure why some folks think there needs to be an age justification to switch to a crossbow they are LEGAL statewide for anyone. Prices are a little salty, but you get what you pay for IMO I don't think there needs to be any kind of justification to shoot one - I was only curious to folks that switched naturally as shoulders, bodies or eyes wouldn't allow when they finally made the switch. I personally have zero desire or itch to switch despite thinking they're an absolute blast to shoot, and do see major advantages of them over my vertical bows I use. I will say when it is bitter cold I always think of calling up my pops and borrowing his crossbow, especially if heading to a blind. What are the.... "major advantages of them over my vertical bows"? Share what IYO are the major advantages crossbows have that you talk of!
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Post by pigeonflier on Dec 21, 2022 5:56:03 GMT -5
If you can't get it done in 4 days time with any gun you wish then your not good enough...nobody needs a month.
Oops I better make my post clear or the peanut gallery will respond...
I meant a 4 day antlered firearm season.
You can kill all the antlerless you want, with any weapon you want, for as long as you want.
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Post by M4Madness on Dec 21, 2022 6:08:16 GMT -5
If you can't get it done in 4 days time with any gun you wish then your not good enough. I'm hoping that this is sarcasm and not your real belief. It has nothing to do with anyone's prowess as a hunter. I'm a decent hunter with close to 100 deer under my belt, and it still took me three weeks of gun hunting this year to get a buck that met my minimums. Sometimes the deer cooperate, sometimes they don't. I don't know the specifics of where you hunt, but it appears that you've been jaded by easily-hunted city deer. 😀
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Post by pigeonflier on Dec 21, 2022 6:43:00 GMT -5
That's got to be the funniest thing I've ever heard someone say. DeRn city deer rock... and not a single one with a gun.
Just fer giggles. This is the first year I was allowed in to put a dent in the city deer population. Just for more giggles I was not invited in because the deer were so easy to kill but rather cause its so easy for me to kill them,, sir...
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Post by pigeonflier on Dec 21, 2022 6:48:06 GMT -5
If you can't get it done in 4 days time with any gun you wish then your not good enough. I'm hoping that this is sarcasm and not your real belief. It has nothing to do with anyone's prowess as a hunter. I'm a decent hunter with close to 100 deer under my belt, and it still took me three weeks of gun hunting this year to get a buck that met my minimums. Sometimes the deer cooperate, sometimes they don't. I don't know the specifics of where you hunt, but it appears that you've been jaded by easily-hunted city deer. 😀 Any other of our neighboring states and you would have had tag soup this year. But just imagine what next year would bring you.
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Post by gumbootbill on Dec 21, 2022 7:07:03 GMT -5
I'm hoping that this is sarcasm and not your real belief. It has nothing to do with anyone's prowess as a hunter. I'm a decent hunter with close to 100 deer under my belt, and it still took me three weeks of gun hunting this year to get a buck that met my minimums. Sometimes the deer cooperate, sometimes they don't. I don't know the specifics of where you hunt, but it appears that you've been jaded by easily-hunted city deer. 😀 Any other of our neighboring states and you would have had tag soup this year. But just imagine what next year would bring you. Tag soup now we're talking my language I marinade my tag in chicken broth overnight in the fridge and it tastes just like chicken. Have old family recipes. "Ancestors were bad hunters also".
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Post by tynimiller on Dec 21, 2022 7:11:37 GMT -5
I don't think there needs to be any kind of justification to shoot one - I was only curious to folks that switched naturally as shoulders, bodies or eyes wouldn't allow when they finally made the switch. I personally have zero desire or itch to switch despite thinking they're an absolute blast to shoot, and do see major advantages of them over my vertical bows I use. I will say when it is bitter cold I always think of calling up my pops and borrowing his crossbow, especially if heading to a blind. What are the.... "major advantages of them over my vertical bows"? Share what IYO are the major advantages crossbows have that you talk of! There are plenty if we are talking just overall: #1 - Form is far less pivotal and truly for the most part you can go without shooting months and pick it up just like that trusty .22 you can put through a squirrel's eye at 30 yards the crossbow is the same way - unless something was changed or came loose (string change/optic loose). #2 - To go along with the above everyone knows that shoots traditional or compound consistent anchor point and form can grossly impact the shot...from precise anchor point to how your standing, arm angle and more. Crossbow again so long as my limbs have clear space I can execute the shot so long as I can shoulder and see through optic. #3 - Movement, movement is one of the most crucial things to avoid to not be picked off by a deer. No draw cycle eliminates a plethora of movement in crunch time. #4 - Clearance/Space, the main time I enjoy or desire to hunt with one is in groundblinds. Plain and simple especially in the low height cheaper blinds a vertical bow simply isn't an option and still be sitting on a traditional height seat, our one doghouse blind I always take a knee to shoot if needed. Crossbow it is raise and shoot. #4b - Blind windows, I find myself not needing to have the blind windows as open. #5 - Bitter cold advantage. I'll be honest I despise drawing my bow when I'm freezing cold or layered up on the bitterest of cold days. #6 - Penetration/Power...So many archers these days aren't getting passthrough due to set up negligence. Crossbows pack a MUCH stronger punch and the likelihood of two holes vs one is elevated IMO which is a great thing. Disadvantages in my opinion are two main ones: cumbersome and heavy.
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Post by pigeonflier on Dec 21, 2022 7:11:50 GMT -5
When your not good enough, your just not good enough. Don't take it as an insult. Just take it as some can and some can't. Not give me more time so I can...
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Post by tynimiller on Dec 21, 2022 7:15:34 GMT -5
It makes sense to me I guess that bowhunters are more the critical ones than gun hunters, because to be fair modern day crossbows are held and have scopes just like their gun counterparts many already are quite familiar with. Actually the vague similarity to firearms is not why gun hunters accept them more readily than bowhunters. There are way too many bowhunters that consider themselves elite hunters and look down on both crossbow AND gun hunters alike..... Most gun hunters that I know dont care what you hunt with as long as it is legal. I just disagree. Most of the bowhunters in my circle don't care one bit either and are only annoyed by folks pretending everything is the same. I've observed the elitist mentality online, however in person or in this rare forum the bowhunters I choose to be around I've never once got that feeling personally.
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Post by M4Madness on Dec 21, 2022 8:46:10 GMT -5
That's got to be the funniest thing I've ever heard someone say. DeRn city deer rock... and not a single one with a gun. Just fer giggles. This is the first year I was allowed in to put a dent in the city deer population. Just for more giggles I was not invited in because the deer were so easy to kill but rather cause its so easy for me to kill them,, sir... When your not good enough, your just not good enough. Don't take it as an insult. Just take it as some can and some can't. Not give me more time so I can... I'm biting my tongue here.
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Post by Woody Williams on Dec 21, 2022 10:21:06 GMT -5
Actually the vague similarity to firearms is not why gun hunters accept them more readily than bowhunters. There are way too many bowhunters that consider themselves elite hunters and look down on both crossbow AND gun hunters alike..... Most gun hunters that I know dont care what you hunt with as long as it is legal. I just disagree. Most of the bowhunters in my circle don't care one bit either and are only annoyed by folks pretending everything is the same. I've observed the elitist mentality online, however in person or in this rare forum the bowhunters I choose to be around I've never once got that feeling personally. Disagree all you want, but I fought that anti-crossbow battle for 10 years. The naysayers are getting fewer now. Heck, even some of them are now hunting with a crossbow.
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Post by tynimiller on Dec 21, 2022 10:21:19 GMT -5
pigeonflier for Christmas I'm going to get you some humility...
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Post by Woody Williams on Dec 21, 2022 10:22:07 GMT -5
When your not good enough, your just not good enough. Don't take it as an insult. Just take it as some can and some can't. Not give me more time so I can... PF, You're going to hurt your chest pounding on it so much..
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Post by tynimiller on Dec 21, 2022 10:23:08 GMT -5
I just disagree. Most of the bowhunters in my circle don't care one bit either and are only annoyed by folks pretending everything is the same. I've observed the elitist mentality online, however in person or in this rare forum the bowhunters I choose to be around I've never once got that feeling personally. Disagree all you want, but I fought that anti-crossbow battle for 10 years. The naysayers are getting fewer now. Heck, even some of them are now hunting with a crossbow. I think that personal experience back before crossbows were one included and two more accepted by the masses is where a lot of the disagreement lies. Today is far different than back then, and as you stated nowadays there are more and more using crossbows than ever before and will only continue to grow as all those "elitists" find themselves for various reasons unable to do vertical bows any longer and yet don't want to stop hunting archery season.
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Post by Woody Williams on Dec 21, 2022 10:23:40 GMT -5
There are numerous pros and cons for any type of any archery equipment for hunting. Been there, done that with all of them.. Accuracy Shooting off hand the compound wins hands down. Absolutely NO contest. That is proven out at any and every archery event where the compounds and crossbows shoot the same targets. If the crossbower can use a rest (not always possible in a deer hunting situation is it?) then the tables are reversed. Although a hunting tool’s good accuracy is a positive and not a negative desire. Trajectory In most bow hunting conditions (less than 25 yards) there is no difference as both the compound bow and crossbow will generate more than enough feet per second and kinetic energy. If the exit speeds are equal downrange the compound will win hands down as the shorter arrow of a crossbow does not stabilize as well and will lose feet per second in speed and KE faster than a compound bow shot (longer) arrow as it attempts to correct itself in flight. Weight Most crossbows weigh in at right around 7 - 8 pounds. That is close to the weight of a lot of rifles and shotguns. The compound bows weigh in much less at 3 to 3 ½ pounds. Holding a crossbow off hand up in shooting position waiting on the deer to clear an obstacle can give you the shakes pretty quickly. A lot quicker than holding up a much lighter weight bow at full draw. I’ve killed better than a dozen deer and a couple turkeys with a crossbow and every one was shot off hand. Then there is the out west hunter hot footing it up and down mountains chasing elk/mule deer.. I came close to leaving a heavy weight Jennings AeroStar compound bow on Horse Fly Peak in Colorao way back when. That heavy arse bow got sold and the next year I chased elk with a much lighter weight Jennings Super T. I’ve hunted elk in Wyoming where crossbows have been legal since day one and have never seen a crossbower on any mountain I was on. Clearances Because of the horizontal limbs a crossbow is much harder to pack into the woods on the way to the stand or still hunting. When hunting from a treestand the horizontal limbs have a major conflict with the vertical tree we are in. That lack of clearance has cost both me and my son a nice buck. It is extremely difficult to shoot behind the treestand as the limbs and string will not allow the crossbow to be up against the tree like a compound bow would. The very first buck I killed with a crossbow almost got away. . He had his nose down to the ground and stood there sniffing a new scrape dead on 20 yards straight behind me tree, but try as I might I could NOT get the crossbow in position because of the tree. The horizontal limbs and the string just would not allow it at all against that vertical tree that I was in. Basically anything behind the treestand is a no shot with a crossbow. Not so with a compound bow. Fortunately for me and unfortunately for him he decided to walk past my tree and go out on front of me. He now resides on my den wall. Drawing/Shooting in the Presence of Game The crossbow has a slight advantage in this area. The string is back in a firing position before game is approaching. How much of an advantage is debatable as several things come into play. 1) Being 20 to 25 foot up a tree when attempting to draw a compound bow will lessen a deer’s ability to see you. 2) Bows are usually 75 to 90 percent let off so one can draw on a deer much sooner and hold longer to make a killing shot with less worry about the deer seeing you. Mike Beatty drew and held on a world record non-typical buck for a full 3 minutes before making the shot. That bow was an 85% let off. There is a bow on the market that is 99% let off (Concept 99) where one can draw the bow as soon as game is spotted and they can wait for however long it takes for that animal to approach the shooting area. “Take your time Mr. Big Buck. I’m only holding in place 6/10s of a pound”. 3) A number of bowhunters that use ground blinds are using a blind called Double Bull, “Doghouse”, etc that allows one to draw and shoot through a curtain and never be seen by the animal. They could do an Irish River Dance and the deer would not see them. Should we ban blinds for deer hunting because the deer can’t see us draw? Should drawing a bow in the presence of game be the prerequisite to archery hunt? 4) Most bowhunters learn when and when not to draw on a deer. IE – when it’s head is behind a bush or tree or allowing the deer to walk past them and shoot them quartering away. Both pieces of equipment have to be raised into a shooting position. Only the compound has to be drawn. That draw should be straight back and covered somewhat by the bow and bow quiver (if one is on the bow). That is unless the person drawing the bow seriously over-bowed and has to horse it back with great exaggerated movements. Some anti crossbowers say drawing on a deer is the hard part of hunting. I call that horse pucky. Getting into position to be in range to kill that deer is the hard part. THAT is the actual hunt, not the execution of the shot. More hunters are busted by their own scent than they are by getting seen drawing a bow. Maybe we should ban cover scents? Regardless of the perceived advantage of “not having to draw back a crossbow” the kill percentages are identical for compounds and crossbows. THAT is where the rubber meets the road. Ease of Mastery The crossbow would have the edge here IF one can rest the crossbow. If not then the compound shooter will have an easier road at mastering his equipment. Regardless, a “newbie” just starting out with either piece of equipment can be shooting hunting accuracy (all arrows in a 6 inch circle at 20 yards) within two hours *IF* properly instructed. Ease of mastery is irrelevant to the hunting aspect. Being a master of your equipment has nothing to do with how good a hunter you are. It only has to do with what kind of shot you are with the equipment at hand should that shot present itself. There is very little difference in mastering a crossbow and a compound off hand. There is a MAJOR difference in mastering a stickbow as opposed to either a crossbow or a compound. If the difficulty mastering the hunting tool is used a yardstick for archery hunting then the season would have to be limited to traditional only.
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Post by pigeonflier on Dec 21, 2022 10:25:28 GMT -5
When your good your just good. I've been that way for years.
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