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Post by bsutravis on Mar 6, 2007 9:31:46 GMT -5
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Post by supr87gt on Mar 6, 2007 10:28:00 GMT -5
That sucks.
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Post by MIG on Mar 8, 2007 13:34:25 GMT -5
Not a big deal...........this has gone on for a long time, instead of making a phone call to get an application, now all you have to do is get on-line.
The amount of nests/eggs destroyed isn't going to change much.
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Post by MIG on Mar 8, 2007 13:35:46 GMT -5
This should put an end to Kyle's good spots!
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Post by johnc911 on Mar 8, 2007 17:08:25 GMT -5
Klye's good spots are our good spots.
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Post by bsutravis on Mar 8, 2007 17:17:28 GMT -5
Honestly speaking MIG, do you really think homeowners even bother to get permits or do they just go break the eggs or destroy the nests without any permits? Have you ever cited someone for next destruction? I just think most people would do it with the thought, "It's my land and I can do it if I want....." mentality.
I just don't think it's fair that we pay for the priviledge to hunt these waterfowl... but yet, someone can basically destroy them for free if they get to the nests before they are hatched. If they can do that, I think that it should be free to hunt in the early goose seasons since we are mainly targeting resident geese anyway. Just my .02.
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Post by supr87gt on Mar 8, 2007 20:35:37 GMT -5
My wife works at an office in caslteton and has an office with a window right by a pond and watched some maintenance guy smash a nest full of eggs last year.  |
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Post by kyle on Mar 9, 2007 6:56:51 GMT -5
This should put an end to Kyle's good spots! those people around there don't even know what a goose egg looks like probably! If they do try to break the eggs I hope the male goose comes after them because this could hurt some of my housing additions. |
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Post by MIG on Mar 10, 2007 1:02:11 GMT -5
Klye's good spots are our good spots. Kyle's good spots are your good spots........that were my good spots until I determined they were too close to homes and I didn't want the cops called everytime a shot went off.........don't need that kinda press. lol.  |
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Post by MIG on Mar 10, 2007 1:38:24 GMT -5
Honestly speaking MIG, do you really think homeowners even bother to get permits or do they just go break the eggs or destroy the nests without any permits? Have you ever cited someone for next destruction? I just think most people would do it with the thought, "It's my land and I can do it if I want....." mentality. I just don't think it's fair that we pay for the priviledge to hunt these waterfowl... but yet, someone can basically destroy them for free if they get to the nests before they are hatched. If they can do that, I think that it should be free to hunt in the early goose seasons since we are mainly targeting resident geese anyway. Just my .02. They ususally just break eggs........kinda like they usually just trap the coon in their attic,outside of season, and don't call a CO as required by law to report it within 72 hrs. and then kill it. I've made some cases on egg/nest destruction. The ones that have done it illegal in the past will continue to do it illegal, and not report it on-line.....their day will come. Most permits issued in the past were for Property Management folks. They would have there maint. supervisors at different locations to do the egg shakin'. Most of the residents, not all, would not mess with them for fear of being evicted, or for fear of the geese themselves. They knew they were paying for someone else to do it so they just left them alone. I'm all about waterfowl hunting/conservaion, etc., but these resident nuisance geese are a problem in metro areas. They are polluting waterways, and it has to be bad when you can't let your kids go outside to play in the yard because it is full of goose poop. Housing additions were great for waterfowlers in the begining........strated turning up a few birds in areas where there never were any. Now most nuisance geese do not even know the are suppose to migrate........generations removed from migrating because they are sipping iced tea on someones deck in Indy. They are stupid! Thats why Kyle can shoot so many of them! lol! Also the geese are getting worse every year as far as attacking folks. Now I'm not talking about attacking someone who is proviking them, or intentionally getting close to their nest, I'm talking about Grandpa Travis, with his walker, just trying to get to the front door of the dentist office and he gets flogged by a few geese protecting a nest near the entrance. Grampa falls and breaks a hip. Had several of those complaints last year.......... whats the answer to that? Let guys shoot 15 per day in the early season? Nope. These stupid park geese won't get close enough to where you can discharge a gun legally! (in most areas) It doesn't have anything to do with goose hunting. It has to do with wildlife management issues.....issues that won't be resolved by hunting alone, even if you hunted for free in the early season! lol. |
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Post by MIG on Mar 10, 2007 1:52:07 GMT -5
I just don't think it's fair that we pay for the priviledge to hunt these waterfowl... but yet, someone can basically destroy them for free if they get to the nests before they are hatched. If they can do that, I think that it should be free to hunt in the early goose seasons since we are mainly targeting resident geese anyway. Just my .02. No, because then I'll have to start a debate about everyone that hits a deer with a car.........is it the deers fault, or were they speeding and couldn't control their vehicle? Does the state owe them $500 from the damage caused by the deer, or does the speeder owe the state $500 for replacement fee for illegally taking a whitetail deer because of their reckless driving? Get out your checkbook 911.........bsu, you can probably pay cash!lol!  I mean hey, i bought a LTL, i don't think its fair that you guys run them down with your vehicles! lol! |
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Post by bsutravis on Mar 10, 2007 3:57:26 GMT -5
I just don't think that it's right. Deer are overpopulated, but if the gov't said that you could go kill fawns in the Spring there would be a huge uproar. If deer laid eggs, do you ever think that deer-egg shaking would be legalized? Geese are wildlife, even if they roam the downtown canal in Indy, or hang out at the Marina of Eagle Creek Res.. To pick up an egg and say, "This hatchling will be stupid and never migrate, nor leave the protection of this neighborhood retention pond so we must therefore destroy it..." is so opposite of everything that waterfowlers do to increase populations.
The analogy of the deer being hit by a car isn't "apples to apples".... That scenario is an accidental destruction, not intentional. I have on occasion sucked up a nest of baby rabbits into the lawn mower..... and felt like heck afterwards, but it wasn't intentional.
It just aggravates me that folks can go and destroy something that we, as hunters, try to protect with our time and $$$. Perhaps rules and regulations that have prohibited waterfowlers from SAFELY reducing the goose population should be looked at versus letting any Joe-Schmo go and crack open the eggs. How many duck eggs are being destroyed under the presumption that it's a goose nest??? I say.... open up Eagle Creek Res. to a draw hunt / goose only..... the same goes for the Marion Co. section of Geist. That's not going to solve the problem, but it would put some hunters into areas that are currently off limits.
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Post by Decatur on Mar 10, 2007 9:51:58 GMT -5
I agree BSU!
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Post by MIG on Mar 12, 2007 0:17:22 GMT -5
I know the deer thing wasn't apples to apples, I just had to poke some fun at the car/deer smokers.........plus, I know you're not gonna budge on your stance.
If your idea would work, it would be great, but it won't.......thats why they have to do egg destruction. Trying to explain, is like talking to a wall, but I'll try this analogy.........one I'm sure you won't agree with either.
Deer Damage Control Permits. They are issued to folks that need damage control, and they need it now, (in MAY-SEPT).......not later in the year. A lot of folks will argue that its not fair to take them that early in the year, and that their "current" problem should be solved later in the year during deer season, and that maybe the solution to the problem would be an increase in antlerless permits, or allowing more than one buck in that area/county. The same folks that whine about deer being taken outside of deer season because they may have a fawn to take care of, are the same folks that would not hesitate to take a nuisance furbearer (raccoon/skuink/beaver) doing damage to THEIR property outside their normal hunting/trapping season.
Neither egg permits nor deer damage control permits have anything to do with hunting. They have to do with folks that are receiving damage to their property because of the said wildlife. If you were in their shoes, you would want the same thing........(and as you read this you will still shake your head and say no I won't,.....because you have spent so much of your time and $$$ managing your flock/herd, but I'm telling you, when your wife says I'm tired of not being able to go outside because that male/female goose chases me, or she says that she is tired of not being able to let the kids play outside because there is sooo much goose poop, then you will change your mind!) Its easy for people to think about their own property, but when it happens on someone elses property, all the can think about is how bad their hunting is going to be the next year because the deer/bird count will be down, or etc., etc.
I'm all about trying to solve wildlife conflicts through hunting seasons/bag limits, etc.........but if that solution is impossible, then you have got to do something.
Eagle Creek and Geist..........not gonna happen. Hunting at Eagle creek would be the best thing that place has ever seen, but it won't happen............for the same reason, you won't hunt Geist either. (at least in some spots!)
Eggs......its whats for breakfast.....bsu, want me to save you some for an easter egg hunt?lol.
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Post by stillwatersniper on Mar 12, 2007 0:26:29 GMT -5
Hunting at Eagle Creek would be great but as MIG said I don't think we'll ever see it but the day they do, I will be in a field somewhere around the reservoir!
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Post by bsutravis on Mar 12, 2007 7:35:57 GMT -5
MIG. Your response to my response wasn't all in vain. I did sit back and think about it before writing this reply, rather than just sound off. I see your points about the conflicts with the goose poo and the ticked off Gander. (I still find the video of geese chasing people to be hilarious) I also understand your point in the parallel with the Deer damage control permits.
I still just can't help myself from rotating my thick skull in a way that I can overlook the fact that we are authorizing the destruction of a species that is SO heavily regulated on a Federal Level. It would be like the residents of Alaska being able to shoot down Bald Eagles because they are cutting down on the amounts of Salmon in the streams of Anchorage. If things are so out of balance between the human population and the geese population, than is it time for the Feds to turn loose of their tight restrictions on the States to handle seasons and limits? If they are so out of balance, than cut down the price of a Federal Waterfowl Stamp in half and allocate all the monies SPECIFICALLY for the preservation of DUCK ONLY habitat, versus waterfowl in general. Is it time that Geese are covered by a small game hunting license if they seem to be, in some people's eyes, no different than a squirrel?
I just can't see why we are forced to jump through so many hoops to help preserve this animal (and I gladly jump through those hoops) only to have anybody who wants, anybody who is untrained, be allowed to go crush these eggs and destroy their nests. If there is a compromise somewhere I think it could be that property owners can destroy a nest as long as there are no eggs in it....
It is an interesting battle as urban sprawl creates this problem.
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Post by chicobrownbear on Mar 12, 2007 8:56:39 GMT -5
Egg shakers should have to buy a federal waterfowl stamp just like I do.
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Post by MIG on Mar 12, 2007 23:25:40 GMT -5
bsu-
Its been my experience that areas overpopulated with geese have extremely poor populations of ducks. I'm not a biologist by any means, but in my opinion, the geese drive out the ducks........and if I had to pick a hunt, it would be one full of ducks and not stupid, non-migrating, nuisance geese!
You can sleep well enough at night knowing this.............the amount of eggs destroyed will probably never put you in a situation where your hunting opportunities are going to be affected.
If that is the case, IMO.....then they are being managed properly.
Well, come September, if any of them make it through shakin' season, I'll try to put you on some stupid city geese! With all of your clay shooting practice, even you should only need to take five shells with you!
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Post by dec on Mar 13, 2007 7:38:51 GMT -5
Guys, if you want to make a difference or at least a small impact, then I encourage you to attend one of these seminars. Take up the seat that would have been taken by a property manager or golf course superintendent. Make your voice known at the seminar that you are a hunter and that hunting is a large part of the goose population solution. Myself and Hotshot, along with some other hunters, are going to the Fort Wayne seminar. I can guarantee we won't be silent on the issue. We, the hunters, are the ones that have provided the money to protect waterfowl and to have the opportunity to hunt these great animals.
The problem is the Federal Government. The Fed's have created a the goose problem by two things. First, the Fed's enacted clean water acts that set in motion that all developments must have storm water detention to reduce sediment and other pollutant carry over from reaching the water ways. The easiest and cheapest way to do this is to simply dig a detention pond. Now, you take a detention pond in a commercial or residential sub division and you manicure the lawn around it to make it look ascetically pleasing and you just created Heaven on Earth for geese. The problem becomes two fold now in 2007 when the Fed's manage the geese like it is the 1970's. So, you have mismanagement of a wildlife species and you have federal regulations in place that require development to build these pond environments that just happen to be the gooses best friend. On top of that you have the coincidence that the United States continues to be the land of excess, so there now has to be a golf course for every 10 people and everyone who owns over 1 acre of land decides the American Dream is to have a small pond in their back yard. What is the goose to do? Breed like crazy, that's what.
What needs to happen is that the Fed's need to turn control of the goose populations back over to the States. Then the states could manage the geese based on where the problems occur. These geese could then be managed through longer hunting seasons, increased bag limits, cooperative relocation projects, habitat deterrent projects, limited nest destruction, and limited egg shaking.
It is a combined effort that can solve the goose problem. But IMO, what is being done by conducting these egg shaking seminars and making it easy to get permission by jumping on the internet, is going to result in nothing but bad press for the Canada goose and put property managers and hunters in a ugly battle. Every Tom Dick and Harry will be out shaking eggs, getting their azzes kicked by a pizzed off gander, destroying duck eggs instead of goose eggs, and making a really cool animal out to be a demon. Just look at how already the swan is perceived here in N.E. Indiana!
The sad part in all this, is that the Canada goose is a pretty amazing animal to watch, listen to, hunt, and simply enjoy. What is going to result in all this is simply bad press for this bird and indirectly us as hunters, when it is neither the birds fault or ours.
Make a difference. Attend a meeting. Write letters. Make phone calls.
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Post by Adam Brown (BGGoosekiller) on Mar 13, 2007 8:08:22 GMT -5
Dang DEC,
You need to be sending that letter out to the DNR and anyone else that might listen. You hit the nail on the head there.
Good Work
Adam
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