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Post by jjas on Apr 2, 2022 20:10:24 GMT -5
I was just reading an article on www.themeateater.com/conservation/policy-and-legislation/why-do-non-resident-licenses-cost-so-much Here's a small part of it. Based on the above, if you look @ surrounding states Indiana is in a position to raise their tag costs. Illinois, Iowa, Ohio and Kentucky all have good deer hunting and over the years, all have become more difficult to secure land to hunt on as a resident or non-resident. I can't speak about Ohio and Kentucky but I have friends (one who is an Illinois resident and another who is an Iowa resident) that have been pushed out of hunting due to leasing in their respective states. Both of them have told me that Indiana's unlimited tags, long seasons, and access to land that another friend has makes it an easy decision to hunt in Indiana. I have a third friend from Georgia who hunts here because of family ties. Perhaps the powers that be in Indiana felt that raising the tag cost for non-residents in the amounts they did is a way to maintain the revenue stream from non-resident hunters while slowing down the numbers of non-resident hunters that deer hunt in Indiana at the same time.
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Post by elmucho277 on Apr 2, 2022 21:20:06 GMT -5
I was just reading an article on www.themeateater.com/conservation/policy-and-legislation/why-do-non-resident-licenses-cost-so-much Here's a small part of it. Based on the above, if you look @ surrounding states Indiana is in a position to raise their tag costs. Illinois, Iowa, Ohio and Kentucky all have good deer hunting and over the years, all have become more difficult to secure land to hunt on as a resident or non-resident. I can't speak about Ohio and Kentucky but I have friends (one who is an Illinois resident and another who is an Iowa resident) that have been pushed out of hunting due to leasing in their respective states. Both of them have told me that Indiana's unlimited tags, long seasons, and access to land that another friend has makes it an easy decision to hunt in Indiana. I have a third friend from Georgia who hunts here because of family ties. Perhaps the powers that be in Indiana felt that raising the tag cost for non-residents in the amounts they did is a way to maintain the revenue stream from non-resident hunters while slowing down the numbers of non-resident hunters that deer hunt in Indiana at the same time. In my case, they will be losing $55 from what they normally make from me in regards to NR tags (used to buy the bundle for $295, now will buy a weapon specific tag for $240). If I didn't already own the land I hunt on in Indiana I would quit hunting there all-together and they would be losing $295. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if the state of Indiana ends up losing money from NR tags with the new pricing as NR hunters can go to Ohio or Kentucky and hunt much cheaper, enjoy a longer season and harvest more deer. Besides, Ohio and arguably Kentucky offer better deer hunting anyway (not a knock against Indiana as I do enjoy hunting there, just looking at B&C numbers and most publication ratings). Plus Ohio has a ton of public hunting ground.
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Post by jjas on Apr 2, 2022 21:40:32 GMT -5
I was just reading an article on www.themeateater.com/conservation/policy-and-legislation/why-do-non-resident-licenses-cost-so-much Here's a small part of it. Based on the above, if you look @ surrounding states Indiana is in a position to raise their tag costs. Illinois, Iowa, Ohio and Kentucky all have good deer hunting and over the years, all have become more difficult to secure land to hunt on as a resident or non-resident. I can't speak about Ohio and Kentucky but I have friends (one who is an Illinois resident and another who is an Iowa resident) that have been pushed out of hunting due to leasing in their respective states. Both of them have told me that Indiana's unlimited tags, long seasons, and access to land that another friend has makes it an easy decision to hunt in Indiana. I have a third friend from Georgia who hunts here because of family ties. Perhaps the powers that be in Indiana felt that raising the tag cost for non-residents in the amounts they did is a way to maintain the revenue stream from non-resident hunters while slowing down the numbers of non-resident hunters that deer hunt in Indiana at the same time. In my case, they will be losing $55 from what they normally make from me in regards to NR tags (used to buy the bundle for $295, now will buy a weapon specific tag for $240). If I didn't already own the land I hunt on in Indiana I would quit hunting there all-together and they would be losing $295. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if the state of Indiana ends up losing money from NR tags with the new pricing as NR hunters can go to Ohio or Kentucky and hunt much cheaper, enjoy a longer season and harvest more deer. Besides, Ohio and arguably Kentucky offer better deer hunting anyway (not a knock against Indiana as I do enjoy hunting there, just looking at B&C numbers and most publication ratings). Plus Ohio has a ton of public hunting ground. As in most things...time will tell.
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Post by whitetaildave24 on Apr 2, 2022 21:42:36 GMT -5
It’s not the end of the world but it just bites for my son and me. He lives and hunts in Virginia. But we had some plans for him to come to Indiana during deer season. It’s not all about killing a deer. It’s as much about us spending time together on the hunt(s). At this point neither of us is inclined to lay out $550. We’re thinking we will get our families together and have a much better time doing something else! The experience is what means the most. Why not just pay for a license for the season he will be here and enjoy the time in the woods together? Don’t have to buy the bundle. Less than half the price for just a one season license.
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Post by HighCotton on Apr 3, 2022 6:59:12 GMT -5
It’s not the end of the world but it just bites for my son and me. He lives and hunts in Virginia. But we had some plans for him to come to Indiana during deer season. It’s not all about killing a deer. It’s as much about us spending time together on the hunt(s). At this point neither of us is inclined to lay out $550. We’re thinking we will get our families together and have a much better time doing something else! The experience is what means the most. Why not just pay for a license for the season he will be here and enjoy the time in the woods together? Don’t have to buy the bundle. Less than half the price for just a one season license. He might buy a license (ie, Buck-Firearms) and he might not! As lots of us do, we started making plans for next deer season as soon as last season ended. Part of this journey has been him building his first AR, set for deer. And all of the other chatter that goes with the planning journey! He cannot even sit in a nearby stand, without a weapon, acting only as an observer/spectator. DNR consider this “assisting” in the hunt and he needs a license for this! Right now, I have the least desire that I’ve ever had for heading to the deer woods! As many of us get older we realize that it’s not so much about ME putting brown down. It’s more about the experience, in my case with family. I’ll probably kick back into some deer fever as my grandson gets fired back up! All said, Not the end of the world. But such a sizable increase has really taken the wind out of the sails!
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Post by deadeer on Apr 3, 2022 7:22:24 GMT -5
The experience is what means the most. Why not just pay for a license for the season he will be here and enjoy the time in the woods together? Don’t have to buy the bundle. Less than half the price for just a one season license. He might buy a license (ie, Buck-Firearms) and he might not! As lots of us do, we started making plans for next deer season as soon as last season ended. Part of this journey has been him building his first AR, set for deer. And all of the other chatter that goes with the planning journey! He cannot even sit in a nearby stand, without a weapon, acting only as an observer/spectator. DNR consider this “assisting” in the hunt and he needs a license for this! Right now, I have the least desire that I’ve ever had for heading to the deer woods! As many of us get older we realize that it’s not so much about ME putting brown down. It’s more about the experience, in my case with family. I’ll probably kick back into some deer fever as my grandson gets fired back up! All said, Not the end of the world. But such a sizable increase has really taken the wind out of the sails! Have been experiencing this "NOT about me" phenomenon for awhile myself. 😉
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Post by Woody Williams on Apr 3, 2022 7:23:09 GMT -5
I agree High Cotton,
If it was not for my grandson all of a sudden taking an interest in deer hunting with me I would have probably hung it up by now. My smoldering hunting fire within me has been rekindled. His exuberance for hunting is great to see. Sitting in the stand he does not miss much. He is absorbing the whole experience. I don’t really care if I kill another deer or turkey or not. I just want him to do good.
He is quite successful in his occupation so yes he can afford the raise in prices *IF* he wanted to. It’s just the principal of the thing.
I’ve always believed in fairness for all hunters. We should be treated equally. Now, that doesn’t mean the NRs should be able to hunt here for the same money, but any increases should be level across the board
My personal opinion is the DNR is again listening to the organized hunting groups that want everything for themselves only.
As far as NR leasing ground up. If they can afford that then the license increase would be chump change for them.
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Post by greghopper on Apr 3, 2022 7:48:39 GMT -5
My only gripe is that ALL licenses should be raised the same percentage. I would of thought by now the upset crowd would had inquired about this and got a answer from DNR! Someone should of asked Joe that question a few weeks ago! I bet there is a reason and formula for why/what was done....Have all increases in the past been equal or same percentage?
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Post by greghopper on Apr 3, 2022 7:53:06 GMT -5
I agree High Cotton, If it was not for my grandson all of a sudden taking an interest in deer hunting with me I would have probably hung it up by now. My smoldering hunting fire within me has been rekindled. His exuberance for hunting is great to see. Sitting in the stand he does not miss much. He is absorbing the whole experience. I don’t really care if I kill another deer or turkey or not. I just want him to do good. He is quite successful in his occupation so yes he can afford the raise in prices *IF* he wanted to. It’s just the principal of the thing. I’ve always believed in fairness for all hunters. We should be treated equally. Now, that doesn’t mean the NRs should be able to hunt here for the same money, but any increases should be level across the board My personal opinion is the DNR is again listening to the organized hunting groups that want everything for themselves only. As far as NR leasing ground up. If they can afford that then the license increase would be chump change for them. Add the NR land owner's to that last statement also IMO! That note has to be higher then a lease.
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Post by boonechaser on Apr 3, 2022 8:32:27 GMT -5
I've been reading about other Midwestern states hunter complaints for their quality of bucks declining. Most notable were IL and Iowa. Seems some of blame is on NR access? Some on state mgt. IDK myself but believe you have to take care of your own first. End day grass is always greener on other side fence they say and IMO it should cost substantially more for out of state hunter access.. JMO.
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Post by greghopper on Apr 3, 2022 8:56:58 GMT -5
I've been reading about other Midwestern states hunter complaints for their quality of bucks declining. Most notable were IL and Iowa. Seems some of blame is on NR access? Some on state mgt. IDK myself but believe you have to take care of your own first. End day grass is always greener on other side fence they say and IMO it should cost substantially more for out of state hunter access.. JMO. I agree.... I seen this statement on another site and also agree. A state's hunting resources are reserved primarily for it's residents. Every single state that offers hunting, works it that way. We're all NR's in 49 states, and can't expect the luxury of hunting in those other 49 states at bargain-basement prices. In a bunch of states, you can't even buy a deer license over the counter as a NR, like you can here. In some, you have to wait your turn and draw, which can take years. IMO an out-of-state, over-the counter deer tag for 240.00 is a true bargain in this day & age, and becoming more and more of a rarity.
Looking at the US cumulative CPI price inflation over the last 20 years....it comes to about 57%. And they raised the license fee by roughly that amount.
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Post by elmucho277 on Apr 3, 2022 18:55:08 GMT -5
My only gripe is that ALL licenses should be raised the same percentage. I would of thought by now the upset crowd would had inquired about this and got a answer from DNR! Someone should of asked Joe that question a few weeks ago! I bet there is a reason and formula for why/what was done....Have all increases in the past been equal or same percentage? I actually did via email to the DNR a few months ago. I had several questions for them in reference to this topic. All were answered to some degree, most pretty thoroughly, but the question of "Why did the NR deer bundle and other NR deer licenses increase at such a larger percentage than resident licenses" went unanswered. I actually greatly appreciated the reply from the Indiana DNR, as I did not expect to hear anything back from them. Plus, it wasn't a form email I received in return as my questions were answered in the order they were sent, except for the above question. I also asked my area state representative via phone, who agreed that those NR rates are absurdly high and they did some research on it. The conclusion the area state representative came to in a return call to me a few days later was the state DNR set the rates after being given permission for an increase from the state of Indiana, and while he agreed with me about the NR rates being absurdly high especially for an Indiana landowner, they were not able to do anything about the actual rates the DNR set.
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Post by greghopper on Apr 3, 2022 19:20:27 GMT -5
I would of thought by now the upset crowd would had inquired about this and got a answer from DNR! Someone should of asked Joe that question a few weeks ago! I bet there is a reason and formula for why/what was done....Have all increases in the past been equal or same percentage? I actually did via email to the DNR a few months ago. I had several questions for them in reference to this topic. All were answered to some degree, most pretty thoroughly, but the question of "Why did the NR deer bundle and other NR deer licenses increase at such a larger percentage than resident licenses" went unanswered. I actually greatly appreciated the reply from the Indiana DNR, as I did not expect to hear anything back from them. Plus, it wasn't a form email I received in return as my questions were answered in the order they were sent, except for the above question. I also asked my area state representative via phone, who agreed that those NR rates are absurdly high and they did some research on it. The conclusion the area state representative came to in a return call to me a few days later was the state DNR set the rates after being given permission for an increase from the state of Indiana, and while he agreed with me about the NR rates being absurdly high especially for an Indiana landowner, they were not able to do anything about the actual rates the DNR set. So there hasn't been a answer to why some license increased at a different rate then others? Maybe try emailing the DNR Director or the state Deer Biologist hopefully someone will give insight on how the increases were decided.
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Post by elmucho277 on Apr 3, 2022 19:41:17 GMT -5
I actually did via email to the DNR a few months ago. I had several questions for them in reference to this topic. All were answered to some degree, most pretty thoroughly, but the question of "Why did the NR deer bundle and other NR deer licenses increase at such a larger percentage than resident licenses" went unanswered. I actually greatly appreciated the reply from the Indiana DNR, as I did not expect to hear anything back from them. Plus, it wasn't a form email I received in return as my questions were answered in the order they were sent, except for the above question. I also asked my area state representative via phone, who agreed that those NR rates are absurdly high and they did some research on it. The conclusion the area state representative came to in a return call to me a few days later was the state DNR set the rates after being given permission for an increase from the state of Indiana, and while he agreed with me about the NR rates being absurdly high especially for an Indiana landowner, they were not able to do anything about the actual rates the DNR set. So there hasn't been a answer to why some license increased at a different rate then others? Maybe try emailing the DNR Director or the state Deer Biologist hopefully someone will give insight on how the increases were decided. The DNR Director was who I emailed and received a reply from in reference to this topic. I did not try contacting the Deer Biologist in reference to this topic since he doesn't have anything to do with setting license rates.
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Post by greghopper on Apr 3, 2022 19:44:16 GMT -5
So there hasn't been a answer to why some license increased at a different rate then others? Maybe try emailing the DNR Director or the state Deer Biologist hopefully someone will give insight on how the increases were decided. The DNR Director was who I emailed and received a reply from in reference to this topic. I did not try contacting the Deer Biologist in reference to this topic since he doesn't have anything to do with setting license rates. You maybe surprised the input he may of had....never hurts to ask IMO So you cant or don't want to give some insight on your answers to questions you asked? If so that's fine and understand.
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Post by firstwd on Apr 3, 2022 19:48:16 GMT -5
You need to ask the NRC these questions since they are the group that recommended the increase, not the DNR.
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Post by elmucho277 on Apr 3, 2022 19:52:41 GMT -5
The DNR Director was who I emailed and received a reply from in reference to this topic. I did not try contacting the Deer Biologist in reference to this topic since he doesn't have anything to do with setting license rates. You maybe surprised the input he may of had....never hurts to ask IMO I did pose some questions to him about his thoughts on this causing a decline in doe harvests, an increase on younger buck harvests, etc. on the podcast interview which was done a week or so ago, but he said he has been happy with the doe to buck harvest ratio and doesn't think there will be a negative affect. I can respect that, after all he is the deer biologist and knows much better than I what the state harvest ratios should be. If you haven't listened to it, it was pretty informative overall
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Post by greghopper on Apr 3, 2022 20:01:19 GMT -5
You maybe surprised the input he may of had....never hurts to ask IMO I did pose some questions to him about his thoughts on this causing a decline in doe harvests, an increase on younger buck harvests, etc. on the podcast interview which was done a week or so ago, but he said he has been happy with the doe to buck harvest ratio and doesn't think there will be a negative affect. I can respect that, after all he is the deer biologist and knows much better than I what the state harvest ratios should be. If you haven't listened to it, it was pretty informative overall I have listened to the podcast twice and never heard anything being asked about license increases for residents or NR affecting how Deer would be harvested in the future or past. There was talk of license structural but not fees or increases...unless I missed something!
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Post by elmucho277 on Apr 3, 2022 20:22:40 GMT -5
I did pose some questions to him about his thoughts on this causing a decline in doe harvests, an increase on younger buck harvests, etc. on the podcast interview which was done a week or so ago, but he said he has been happy with the doe to buck harvest ratio and doesn't think there will be a negative affect. I can respect that, after all he is the deer biologist and knows much better than I what the state harvest ratios should be. If you haven't listened to it, it was pretty informative overall I have listened to the podcast twice and never heard anything being asked about license increases for residents or NR affecting how Deer would be harvested in the future or past. There was talk of license structural but not fees or increases...unless I missed something! My questions were just before yours, from 26:35 until 38:35. I did not ask specifically about license fees for NR causing these issues, I asked if he thought the license structure (referring to buck only with a firearm permit since I would presume most NR hunters will be purchasing this instead of the bundle in the future, though I did not include this NR presumption in the question) had an effect on doe harvest numbers, young buck harvest, buck to doe harvest ratios, etc.
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Post by greghopper on Apr 3, 2022 20:30:45 GMT -5
You need to ask the NRC these questions since they are the group that recommended the increase, not the DNR. Good point.... surprised he wasnt directed to the NCR for answers. Sounds like the Director answered something. Here is contact link to NRC for anyone looking www.in.gov/nrc/contact
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