|
Post by firstwd on Mar 29, 2016 5:10:28 GMT -5
Which has the unintended consequence of making the 40sw legal as well. I think most would agree that's light for deer but it is what it is. In my opinion the smallest cartridge, for hunting Deer, is the 7.62 X 39 m/m cartridge. Lots of these pistol cartridges, regardless of caliber, lack the power to take Deer sized game. It all depends on the shooter and shot placement. Several of us can kill deer with a 22 short.
|
|
|
Post by drs on Mar 29, 2016 6:19:00 GMT -5
In my opinion the smallest cartridge, for hunting Deer, is the 7.62 X 39 m/m cartridge. Lots of these pistol cartridges, regardless of caliber, lack the power to take Deer sized game. It all depends on the shooter and shot placement. Several of us can kill deer with a 22 short. Shooting Deer with a .22 R.F. is not only careless, but inhumane. Only "poachers" would use such a cartridge.
|
|
|
Post by budd on Mar 29, 2016 6:33:48 GMT -5
It all depends on the shooter and shot placement. Several of us can kill deer with a 22 short. Shooting Deer with a .22 R.F. is not only careless, but inhumane. Only "poachers" would use such a cartridge. I use one all the time, keep it in my truck year round. Never know when you will see a porky!! I have killed SEVERAL hogs and beef with one....sure it would do the same to a deer....how is using a 22 "inhumane"? That word scares me, I hear certain groups that use that term all the time..group's that wish to take our hunting privileges away.
|
|
|
Post by Woody Williams on Mar 29, 2016 7:22:23 GMT -5
DNR statement..
Please see the department's response below regarding the rifle bill....
------ Original message------
Thank you for your question(s) about HEA 1231. Complete language can be found athttp://iga.in.gov/legislative/2016/bills/house/1231. The bill was passed by the State Legislature and has been signed by the Governor. DNR understands there are many questions about the new law, and we’re attempting to get clarification on some of those outstanding questions. In the meantime, we ask everyone to be patient. Details will be printed in this year's DNR Hunting/Trapping Regulations guide that comes out in July, or posted on the DNR website if available sooner.
|
|
|
Post by greghopper on Mar 29, 2016 7:32:42 GMT -5
Unless they change the actual written law not sure how the guidebook will hold up in court once someone get a ticket.
It Been said here many a time the guide book is not the end all for the actual rules...
|
|
|
Post by drs on Mar 29, 2016 7:51:22 GMT -5
Shooting Deer with a .22 R.F. is not only careless, but inhumane. Only "poachers" would use such a cartridge. I use one all the time, keep it in my truck year round. Never know when you will see a porky!! I have killed SEVERAL hogs and beef with one....sure it would do the same to a deer....how is using a 22 "inhumane"? That word scares me, I hear certain groups that use that term all the time..group's that wish to take our hunting privileges away. ANYONE who would hunt or shoot a Deer, with a .22 R.F., is an IDIOT in my opinion. Sure, one can kill any of the game you mentioned, with a .22 R.F., but for the average Deer Hunter this would be STUPID. <Sorry but that's the way I feel>
|
|
|
Post by budd on Mar 29, 2016 8:10:09 GMT -5
I agree, ANYONE that would HUNT deer with one would be careless, but my warden called and asked if I would go put down a car hit deer by my house and the old 22 killed him stone dead, which was ETHICAL. Maybe I was taking your text out of context, I believe firstwd was just trying to say/make a point smaller caliber cartridge's can be just as deadly as larger cartridge's in the rite shooters hands...and I agree without making a big deal of it or taking it out of context, I get his POINT. <that's how I feel>
|
|
|
Post by M4Madness on Mar 29, 2016 8:42:19 GMT -5
Unless they change the actual written law not sure how the guidebook will hold up in court once someone get a ticket. It Been said here many a time the guide book is not the end all for the actual rules... I'm sure it's safe to say that the DNR will certainly go by how the bill happens to be written when it's time for the regs to be printed.
|
|
|
Post by greghopper on Mar 29, 2016 9:11:04 GMT -5
Unless they change the actual written law not sure how the guidebook will hold up in court once someone get a ticket. It Been said here many a time the guide book is not the end all for the actual rules... I'm sure it's safe to say that the DNR will certainly go by how the bill happens to be written when it's time for the regs to be printed. Yep.... And the way it's written now as what guns will be legal is open for interpretation at best.
|
|
|
Post by medic22 on Mar 29, 2016 9:32:29 GMT -5
DNR is currently recognizing the bill as written to be calibers and not cartridges per the facebook page of all the districs LE division.
|
|
|
Post by tynimiller on Mar 29, 2016 9:47:33 GMT -5
If directed at my semi-auto comments, pumping the action does not necessarily make one "safer". However, I have always been personally of the mindset a auto-loader doesn't encourage as much safety as one which requires some time racking, lever working or bolt running...now before someone brings up the "I can work my pump...." I know and get that if practiced folks can fire some very fast shot with pumps and even bolts (youtube it...impressive)...however it requires skill and practice time to do quick follow up shots with these weapons. I can make a similar argument opposite to yours in that someone trying to take a 2nd shot is going to be so busy and consumed with working the action that they could end up rushing that follow-up shot instead of taking the time to be safe and accurate about it. Time is the constant here, and sometimes follow-up shots don't offer a big window of opportunity. I've never needed a follow-up shot (bow or gun hunting), but that hasn't stopped me from going thru the motions of being ready to take it - just in case. This all comes down to each shooter's abilities and habits. If someone is safe with a bolt action, pump, lever, or single shot; who is to say they won't be as safe with a semi-auto? Having the gun load that 2nd round for me doesn't make me ignore the lessons I've learned about shot placement, aiming, knowing what's beyond the target, etc. It simply gives me more time to focus on all those aspects of shooting since I'm not worrying about "racking the next round".If you don't trust yourself with a semi-auto, then don't bring one to the field. But don't assume the mere act of letting people hunt with semi-autos is going to make them unsafe - if they are safe shooters to begin with. Like I have said repeatedly in this thread - there are many semi-auto guns that have been legal to hunt deer with FOR YEARS. And I haven't heard of any major problems associated with them. Just a bunch of speculation and hand-ringing now since a particular black rifle can be used... I think you guys are taking my opinion as a challenge...it isn't. In my opinion yes, I know many a person, I've watched many come into the gun shop and walk out with semi-auto rifles that have no business hitting the woods with them, but they will. If you'd force these folks to slow down, yes without a doubt in my mind it would help. Work in a gun store for a month or so and you QUICKLY learn just what kind of company us firearm owners have....anti's are not all stupid for feeling the way they do depending who they have met. I get it however, stupidity of few shouldn't outweigh the rights of the many and I get that...I do. Just because some idiot shoots up a theatre or a church doesn't mean I should lose my rights...strong example, but same angle. One could also make the same statement though about speed limits....is it right to limit the speed of those who can handle it because some cannot? At what point does the inherent danger outweigh the rights? I don't make those statements as a challenge but just as a way to hopefully get you to just think...not to change your mind, but if anything strengthen your opinion by at the very least admitting their is some validity to the opposing argument. I've always thought semi-autos encourage bad habits in the hunting world...still do...and in 20 years still will. I want my hunting firearms centered around the one shot mentality (whether a single shot or not) and not know I can instantly send another round down range as fast as my little finger can make it happen. **If I am brutally honest even I break this "rule" of mine though 1 or 2 times a year...when I grab my old marlin 22 tube fed semi-auto to go squirrel hunting...but I NEVER do this when young or new hunters are with. But that is all personal opinion, I don't expect it to change or affect yours one bit. ALSO just to be crystal clear. I 100% agree, no firearm controls someone's danger levels. A properly handled and practiced with firearm of ANY action, ANY caliber used ANYwhere will be a safe firearm.
|
|
|
Post by realhunter on Mar 29, 2016 10:22:23 GMT -5
-FIFY-DNR is currently recognizing the bill as written to be calibers cartridges and not cartridges calibers per the facebook page of all the districs LE division.
|
|
|
Post by M4Madness on Mar 29, 2016 10:46:54 GMT -5
Heck, there's already talk on INGO that it will be legal to use brass of approved cartridges and neck them down to whatever bullet diameter is desired. Something about the bill's use of the word "chambered", but I myself don't see it.
|
|
|
Post by swilk on Mar 29, 2016 11:06:48 GMT -5
Lawmakers must have gallons of gray ink.... Its actually kind of impressive how they can screw up something that should be so simple.
|
|
|
Post by M4Madness on Mar 29, 2016 11:17:35 GMT -5
I guess that the bill should have read "No modification of the cartridge neck diameter and no sabot rounds".
|
|
|
Post by tynimiller on Mar 29, 2016 11:20:29 GMT -5
Heck, there's already talk on INGO that it will be legal to use brass of approved cartridges and neck them down to whatever bullet diameter is desired. Something about the bill's use of the word "chambered", but I myself don't see it. I see "0" point in that much effort. Some folks are never happy.
|
|
|
Post by sakorifle on Mar 29, 2016 11:28:06 GMT -5
Greetings Lets be honest here, it does not matter what they said it is not going to suit everyone. ans i include myself over here in th euk. They changed the law here for small deer but left out the hornet, now my hornet has killed a lot of roe in its time it is deadly in the right hands. didnt suit me but there we go. over here it is a specific bullet weight with a specific muzzle energy, that knocks out the hornet and anything less thatn a 222. anything that meets that criterea is legal for deer regardless of calibre if one can justify it to the police. regards Billy
|
|
|
Post by bart1533 on Mar 29, 2016 11:35:05 GMT -5
Heck, there's already talk on INGO that it will be legal to use brass of approved cartridges and neck them down to whatever bullet diameter is desired. Something about the bill's use of the word "chambered", but I myself don't see it. I see "0" point in that much effort. Some folks are never happy. Exactly.....
|
|
|
Post by swilk on Mar 29, 2016 11:36:38 GMT -5
-FIFY-DNR is currently recognizing the bill as written to be calibers cartridges and not cartridges calibers per the facebook page of all the districs LE division. Even dissecting the wording of that post I still feel they are going by diameter. The reference to cartridge was saying how many you can possess in the field. It says "rifles" and then goes on to list the wording of the law which is not cartridge specific. Big ol mess it is right now ..... I hope they dont clarify it. I plan to buy a 7mm-08 and have .308 engraved on the barrel.
|
|
|
Post by tynimiller on Mar 29, 2016 11:52:52 GMT -5
-FIFY- Even dissecting the wording of that post I still feel they are going by diameter. The reference to cartridge was saying how many you can possess in the field. It says "rifles" and then goes on to list the wording of the law which is not cartridge specific. Big ol mess it is right now ..... I hope they dont clarify it. I plan to buy a 7mm-08 and have .308 engraved on the barrel. I think I am going to engrave 30-06 on my bow...wait... haha!
|
|