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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 12:22:20 GMT -5
Land, they aren't making any more of it! Value will ALWAYS go up. Money spent on lease is gone for good. Money spent on land is an investment with guaranteed return. That was almost verbatim the argument I made with my buddy over leasing versus buying. We generally agreed until we got to the part about how to explain that same concept to our wives. That's where things slowed down... a lot... Selling them on the lease was going to be hard enough at a couple grand but now we're talking about a huge down payment and a 20-30 year mortgage. It's a logical sell, but a hard sell. For me personally though, we just moved from here to Asia and then from Asia back to here again in the last 4 years. We have a lot of debt to pay down before we look at another piece of real estate but we can afford a one time lease.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 12:12:05 GMT -5
I think the biggest problem people truly have with them is that $30,000 will buy somebody a deer that most people can hunt their whole lives for. Time is money. That sounds like a really round about way to describe petty jealousy. I can honestly relate if that same deer was kidnapped from the wild population but if it was raised on the farm it was shot in then it doesn't count as game in my opinion. That's like getting angry at Marsh in November because they have all the big toms you couldn't call in for sale in their freezer case. Again, it's about ethics of procurement. If Marsh was using helicopters with FLIR and hand grenades to fill their freezers out of the wilderness then I'd be upset.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 11:56:53 GMT -5
This is a complicated issue that mixes up business ethics and outdoorsman's ethics and several other highly subjective and debatable things. It's like it was designed by scientists to start a bar fight.
My answer is this: There are too many variables that can swing this issue from acceptable to deplorable and I won't take a stand that gets counted as a simple yes or no.
Like pay lakes and put and takes, I judge the moral and ethical alignment of these operations on how they're managed and not as a general concept.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 10:30:51 GMT -5
I have the exact same rifle. Bought it a few years ago. It has a Nikon 4-12x40 Buckmasters II in low rings. Shoots awesome! Super-soft recoil pad, too, as you can see the bottom of the pad flattened out in your picture. Yeah, I'm really happy with how it shoots. The scope on this one is a Bushnell Trophy XLT 3-9x40 that I got on clearance online. So far it's been really nice for what I paid for it and they seem to have good reviews. The recoil pad is very soft for certain. I don't think I've ever had one this soft actually. Have you had a chance to take it out hunting at all?
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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 10:16:16 GMT -5
I was working up a load for the American in '06, recoil was stiff but manageable. Fixed the hollow sound with a dowel rod and a bunch of Walmart bags. I was thinking about something a little heavier but that's a great way to use walmart bags. I've heard of people saving enough of them to insulate their attics and apparently they make great insulation when you pack them between wall or ceiling studs. The only sounds I get out of my American that seem odd are coming from the bipod. It rings like a bell after every shot when I'm shooting off my shoulder. I kind of like it though.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 10:01:16 GMT -5
If your Ruger Americans' buttstock is hollow, you might place some weight inside the stock to dampen recoil. My .308 Ruger Compact Magnum weighs a bit over 7 pounds with scope, same for my other .308 which is a custom stocked S & W Model "B". Both have open sights but I have Leupold scopes mounted on them. I have a 12 gauge pump shotgun and I have placed some weight (lead shot) inside the buttstock and this takes a lot of the recoil out. Yeah, I've been seeing that in some of the Ruger forums. There's a few guys filling them with concrete patch but I don't think I want to do that. One guy used plumbers putty so he could take it out easily if he needed to and I think that sounds more reasonable. With the putty I can add empty PVC to lighten it or PVC filled with lead or oil to dampen it more if I need more weight. I can also take the putty out when I go hunting so the gun doesn't weigh me down all day. I'm gonna try the Limbsaver pad first though and see how that goes before I make any other mods.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 9:42:02 GMT -5
I own two .308 rifles, and recoil was never an issue for me. I always considered the .308 having mild recoil, with both factory loads and my hand loads. I can shoot 30 rounds or more at the bench with no discomfort. Both my rifles have wood stocks, with one having a laminated stock & the Ruger having a walnut stock. I agree about .308 recoil being relatively mild. I had a Ruger Hawkeye in .338mag in high school and that thing was a killer compared to this. Even our .30-30 Marlin was punchier and the 12 gauge I have now, even with the heavy gas ring installed, is still worse with full power slugs. I think I mostly just need to shoot more and I can do that with a better recoil pad I'm betting.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 26, 2017 9:33:51 GMT -5
I own two .308 rifles, and recoil was never an issue for me. I always considered the .308 having mild recoil, with both factory loads and my hand loads. I can shoot 30 rounds or more at the bench with no discomfort. Both my rifles have wood stocks, with one having a laminated stock & the Ruger having a walnut stock. Mostly comes down to what you are used to/have experience with. My 30-06 doesn't recoil at all to me but I have a 416Rigby; if all I had experience with was a 243 and I picked up that 06 I guessing I'd think it had recoil. There's a couple of things going on with the recoil issue. The biggest one is that I was overseas for 3 years and didn't fire a shot the whole time. I used to shoot my 12 gauge and my CX4 often enough before I moved that I barely noticed any recoil issues. Another thing is that the stock on this American is hollow plastic and the forend is really just a handrest/place to mount a bipod. It isn't structurally anything more than a plastic honeycomb. I appreciate how incredibly light the rifle is at it makes it a great field gun but at the same time that lightness makes it uncomfortable for me from the bench. All in all it isn't terrible, I just need to step up the recoil pad a notch and it'll be fine.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 16:55:17 GMT -5
I'm not sure if he means that he bought the plot for that much at a tax sale or if he pays that much in taxes annually after the purchase. I changed it To better understand ,,I pay that annually and that's with 88 acres in Classified wild lands assessed at one dollar an acre ,, Bought right after the homestead act lol Point is a place like mine you can't own for 3000 a year so leasing really not that bad a deal I get it now, thanks for that. If you ever consider leasing access to your place it sounds like it'd be well worth the money.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 14:27:02 GMT -5
LOL! I guess he picked that user name honestly then...
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 14:26:09 GMT -5
I had these in my safe already so I threw them on out of excitement at getting a new rifle. I wanted to see if the hype about the accuracy and the excellent trigger in the American was true or not so I went with what I had.
I have all year to get this thing set up and ready for deer season. I can try any number of rings between now and then. I'm surprised nobody said anything about the sling yet. I got it free with the rifle and even so, I hate it on this gun. I put it on my shotgun instead and it's nice on it.
The day we jumped Buckasaurus Rex, I was on 4x magnification if I remember right. That's how close we were when we saw him. We were coming up a little creek that ran along a line of tall trees with 5 foot high briars all along them and when we cleared the briar patch he was right there.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 14:14:14 GMT -5
I'm not sure if he means that he bought the plot for that much at a tax sale or if he pays that much in taxes annually after the purchase.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 12:36:48 GMT -5
To put it in perspective I paid 1600$ taxes and 1800 insurance to own 125 acres 3400.00 not counting all the habitat work I do to hunt my place $3400 for 125 acres? At a tax auction I'm assuming?
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 12:35:33 GMT -5
This is the other reason I went ahead and bought the American in .308. I really do want to hunt out west in the rockies and see that land from the ground. Do you use a guide service? If so do you mind sharing it? No guides, just DIY on public land. Only costs are the license and getting there/back. That sounds awesome man. I'm definitely going to look into that as well. Where is your profile pic from?
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 11:13:12 GMT -5
I've been leasing hunting ground for over ten years, currently have a 260 acre lease that a friend and I split on. Your budget is pretty low, so you will probably need a partner. You can probably pick up 80 acres of decent deer ground for somewhere around $1500-1800 per year. Leasing gets a lot of negative comments on these forums. People get mad because the place they used to hunt for free is no longer available and leased by outsiders. It's just the way of the world these days, you have to pay to play, and land owners need the income. Going through one of the leasing companies is just real easy for the average guy. I've used both Basecamp leasing and The Hunting lease network, no trouble with either. Good luck ! Thanks steniy, I figured there would be a social/political angle to all this. I'm all for doing the leg work and knocking on doors but I live in Indianapolis so I have to drive a long way to get to good ground and then I have to figure out who owns the land I want to hunt and get to know them. As much as I'd prefer that way, it isn't really practical for me. I have a buddy who wants to go in on the lease with me and his budget is basically the same as mine. We're talking about trying to buy a plot of land now too. There are some for sale for cheap enough where we could get a mortgage on it and sell a couple of leases to cover some of the costs.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 10:56:37 GMT -5
Honestly, be cheaper if you are gonna buy something for public lands to just do a Muzzleloader. Pretty much modern inline with practice and load selection is a 200-250 yard range harvesting tool for sure. And can be had relatively cheap compared to some of the things mentioned. My brother swears by his TC inline. He takes deer almost every season in OH with his. I have no experience with them and the little time I put in with muzzleloaders growing up was spent being frustrated with all the little problems I had with the CVA Hawken kit rifle we put together. I just prefer modern rifles I think. I'd double my arguments with my wife if I bought the gear for a whole new weapon system.
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 9:23:19 GMT -5
I've been a Volquartsen fan for a very long time. I built a 10/22 with their parts back in the day when they only made one rifle and mixed parts out of a pole barn in the backyard. That thing is still the best shooting most accurate rifle I've ever owned. I took many a squirrel and rabbit with it and a fair share of doves and a couple of grouse.
I didn't know they were making 77 parts now. I need to check out their Web site...
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 9:04:42 GMT -5
I almost got into leasing a few years ago, but had to decide between out of state trips and an Indiana hunting lease. I can go on 2 big game hunts out west each year, and have access to millions of acres of public land, for less than the going rate of a 50 acre lease around here. I've started utilizing the HNF around here a lot more the last couple years, and the hunting has been a lot better than I expected; just as good as my 2 small private property spots. This is the other reason I went ahead and bought the American in .308. I really do want to hunt out west in the rockies and see that land from the ground. Do you use a guide service? If so do you mind sharing it?
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Post by TolusD on Jan 25, 2017 8:58:47 GMT -5
I don't have any problem hunting public land at all. I just can't use a rifle there and it's what I know best for deer. All my shotgunning experience is with birds. Even rabbits I prefer a .22 for. I guess at the end of the day I'm a rifle guy. I believe you can use a P.C.R (Pistol Cartridge Rifle) on some public lands, in Indiana. If not then buy a rifled barrel and use sabot slugs for hunting Deer. I have my eye on a .44mag Ruger M77 bolt gun or if I'm real lucky a Deerstalker carbine. I got the American for less than half what either of those cost so I got it first. : )
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Post by TolusD on Jan 24, 2017 21:08:57 GMT -5
Why not just hunt public land? 100's of thousands of acres. Get you a GPS and find out of the way small spots. You'd be surprised how many you'll have to yourself. I don't have any problem hunting public land at all. I just can't use a rifle there and it's what I know best for deer. All my shotgunning experience is with birds. Even rabbits I prefer a .22 for. I guess at the end of the day I'm a rifle guy.
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