|
Post by genesis273 on Dec 23, 2018 6:16:09 GMT -5
So I'm buying a new bow in a few months. With the ridiculous prices of bows these days I need to make sure it's of decent quality because I won't be able afford another one for several years. I think I have narrowed my choices down to 3 bows. 2 of the bows are what I refer to as "speed bows" and the other, not so much. In my mind, I have always thought of a speed bow as unforgiving and rough on the draw cycle. I have little to no real experience with them though to give an accurate description. What I am trying after is a bow that can help my arrow and broad head set up (Carbon Express Maxima Red 250 topped with a Wasp Jak-Hammer and Nocturnal strobbing nocks) gain the most kinetic energy. Kinetic energy is more important to me than speed. However, I'm sure the 2 have to work together to gain maximum effectiveness. So am I better served seeking a bow with a higher IBO speed, shorter brace height? Or with a stiffer arrow, should I be looking to keep the 7" brace height and a little longer ATA?
|
|
|
Post by genesis273 on Dec 23, 2018 10:07:25 GMT -5
I guess momentum is what I'm really after.
|
|
|
Post by medic22 on Dec 23, 2018 10:43:25 GMT -5
Without changing your arrow set up, adding speed is the only way to add kinetic energy.
|
|
|
Post by genesis273 on Dec 23, 2018 11:20:21 GMT -5
Without changing your arrow set up, adding speed is the only way to add kinetic energy. Are you suggesting a heavier arrow maybe?
|
|
|
Post by varmint101 on Dec 23, 2018 12:57:41 GMT -5
Speed doesn’t mean much to me other than how much your arrow will drop. Your arrow/broad head combo shooting perfectly and a heavy enough arrow is what you need. To me it’s ridiculous chasing a certain FPS number though lots of archers do. If you have a heavier arrow your bow will be quieter and you will blow through most anything without a problem. Any bow today will give you plenty of speed. If you think you need a faster bow 3 years down the road it’s not because the bow won’t kill its because your jonesing for another bow lol I know that problem LOL get a bow you can handle. One that draws smooth and doesn’t want to run away from you at full draw if you let down a little well, unless you like that. Some do. You can bump up your arrow weight by going with a stiffer spine and adding weight to the front via brass insert and or heavier point but you have to know what you’re doing to keep everything in tune.
|
|
|
Post by Woody Williams on Dec 23, 2018 13:20:35 GMT -5
Speed doesn’t mean much to me other than how much your arrow will drop. Your arrow/broad head combo shooting perfectly and a heavy enough arrow is what you need. To me it’s ridiculous chasing a certain FPS number though lots of archers do. If you have a heavier arrow your bow will be quieter and you will blow through most anything without a problem. Any bow today will give you plenty of speed. If you think you need a faster bow 3 years down the road it’s not because the bow won’t kill its because your jonesing for another bow lol I know that problem LOL get a bow you can handle. One that draws smooth and doesn’t want to run away from you at full draw if you let down a little well, unless you like that. Some do. You can bump up your arrow weight by going with a stiffer spine and adding weight to the front via brass insert and or heavier point but you have to know what you’re doing to keep everything in tune. This.. I am now in the “momentum” camp. The deer I kill are usually no further than 30 yards so the speed/arc is of little consequences..
|
|
|
Post by medic22 on Dec 23, 2018 13:59:13 GMT -5
Without changing your arrow set up, adding speed is the only way to add kinetic energy. Are you suggesting a heavier arrow maybe? A heavier arrow or some inserts. The piledriver hunter with 50gr brass inserts its 9ne of my favorite arrows.
|
|
|
Post by genesis273 on Dec 23, 2018 16:18:06 GMT -5
Speed doesn’t mean much to me other than how much your arrow will drop. Your arrow/broad head combo shooting perfectly and a heavy enough arrow is what you need. To me it’s ridiculous chasing a certain FPS number though lots of archers do. If you have a heavier arrow your bow will be quieter and you will blow through most anything without a problem. Any bow today will give you plenty of speed. If you think you need a faster bow 3 years down the road it’s not because the bow won’t kill its because your jonesing for another bow lol I know that problem LOL get a bow you can handle. One that draws smooth and doesn’t want to run away from you at full draw if you let down a little well, unless you like that. Some do. You can bump up your arrow weight by going with a stiffer spine and adding weight to the front via brass insert and or heavier point but you have to know what you’re doing to keep everything in tune. I'm definitely not chasing speed . Just want to have good momentum. I have never purchased a "high end" bow. I've been shooting a mission's for several years now. Although it's a nice bow and i have harvested deer with it, want something different. Less vibration, stiffer back wall and not as much creep. And yes, a little more speed would be nice. It sounds like I may need to change my arrow set up as well. I love the Maxima Red so I'll try and figure something out. As you folks can tell, I don't know a whole lot about bows but I'm learning more as I go.
|
|
|
Post by genesis273 on Dec 23, 2018 16:42:49 GMT -5
I'm sure I'm going to have to spend quite a bit of time in the bow shop handling different bows. Just trying to narrow my choices down before hand I suppose. I'll be shopping for a new release as well so once I get a bow I'll have to try some of those out too
|
|
|
Post by lureinthemin on Dec 24, 2018 12:34:14 GMT -5
You may have to look around or make your own weights you can find inserts that Insert into the Arrow shaft Before the threaded Insert does to adjust Arrow tip / Arrow weight A smooth drawing Bow that is moderate in speed and a tack Arrow shaft will always be better than a torpedo that is a racket of a Bow on obtaining a few feet per second more what really is 30-40 more feet per second Nothing in the right hands
Sound travels What per second? about 1,066 feet per second about, so a Bow striking an Arrow shaft out of it @ 500 FPS that Bow IS Not worth nothing in comparison with Sound IMHEO
|
|
|
Post by medic22 on Dec 24, 2018 12:46:06 GMT -5
Im sure your inserts are glued but if they shoot well for you I would stick with the maxima reds with a heavier insert.
|
|
|
Post by varmint101 on Dec 24, 2018 16:32:17 GMT -5
Right on, sounds like a fun time for you! Always fun looking. Go and try out all the bows you can and figure out what you want. It’s ok to look at it for opinions on bows, but everyone has different tastes. I’ve always stuck with Mathews and Hoyt just due to resale and the fact I like their bows and can count on them. Once you figure out what bow and specs you want then figure out what arrow setup you want.
|
|
|
Post by scrub-buster on Dec 24, 2018 18:05:09 GMT -5
Any bow you get will be plenty fast enough. My hunting bows shoot in the 160 fps range.
|
|
|
Post by genesis273 on Dec 24, 2018 19:52:27 GMT -5
Right on, sounds like a fun time for you! Always fun looking. Go and try out all the bows you can and figure out what you want. It’s ok to look at it for opinions on bows, but everyone has different tastes. I’ve always stuck with Mathews and Hoyt just due to resale and the fact I like their bows and can count on them. Once you figure out what bow and specs you want then figure out what arrow setup you want. That's the plan! Handle a few different bows, hopefully pick one. Then build my arrows to gain the most optimum hard hitting momentum. Then sample some releases and pick out a nice matching quiver. I'm sure it'll be a timely but fun experience.
|
|
|
Post by huntnandplumbn on Dec 24, 2018 20:08:40 GMT -5
Speed = Tougher Tuning
Speed + Light arrow = Even Tougher Tuning
Speed + Quality Mechanical Head= Not needing to be a NASA Engineer to shoot Great Even At Long Distance and FAR LESS TUNING
Speed + Fixed Blade = Good Luck on Anything Past 30 Yards Grouping Wise
|
|
|
Post by dbd870 on Dec 25, 2018 7:48:23 GMT -5
Yeah it can be more difficult. I use a fixed head on my crossbow and it took some experimentation and some communication with a custom arrow maker (Jerry @ Tapp) but I have a good fixed head set up now. 405gr at 335fps. I’m using spine indexed arrows and QAD heads; the QAD’s are one of the easiest fixed heads to get to fly well according to him and others who have spent time experimenting with heads. Of the half dozen of his 4 hit dead on at 40 yards and 2 are a couple of inches right; not a big deal but I use those 2 for 3D etc. While this is fairly moderate for a crossbow it serves well to make the point for compounds.
He used BEE shafts (which are good shafts) as I was not looking for a target arrow but he offers builds with other shafts that will do better. He stopped making vertical bow arrows just recently; which is unfortunate. I’d certainly would have recommended him to anyone shooting the newer compounds.
|
|
|
Post by genesis273 on Dec 26, 2018 6:37:48 GMT -5
Another thought, I don't think I need to beef up my arrow too much to gain some extra momentum. My current thought is just to increase my broadheads from 100grain to 125. Along with the addition of 50grain brass inserts. In my simple headed mind, it's not that much added weight but, we are simply talking about weight in grains, not pounds. So will the added weight interfere with my arrow spine? Perhaps through off the front of center too much?
|
|
|
Post by dbd870 on Dec 26, 2018 7:53:07 GMT -5
Usually 25gr isn’t going to make much of a difference. If your spine is right on the edge maybe. Adding FOC is a good thing
|
|
|
Post by jman46151 on Dec 27, 2018 11:17:10 GMT -5
Another thought, I don't think I need to beef up my arrow too much to gain some extra momentum. My current thought is just to increase my broadheads from 100grain to 125. Along with the addition of 50grain brass inserts. In my simple headed mind, it's not that much added weight but, we are simply talking about weight in grains, not pounds. So will the added weight interfere with my arrow spine? Perhaps through off the front of center too much? I've been thinking about switching from 100 gr to 125 gr broadheads to gain a little momentum. I shoot mechanicals and would like a little more KE at the hit. I've only shot one buck with my bow and didn't have a complete pass through. It looked like the broadhead stopped at the armpit area on the opposite shoulder. It did hit some kind of weird fat/infection pocket but seemed like it should have went through. If I didn't already have a new package of heads I probably would have switched this year. After reading a classic "fixed vs mechanical" thread on another forum I noticed one person who swore by mechanicals was shooting 125 gr so I started to dig into it and it seems like with the newer, faster bows the fps lost is negligible compared to the penetration gained. One of the articles I found while researching: link
|
|
|
Post by bartiks on Dec 28, 2018 1:08:19 GMT -5
Wow, I was going to start getting into bow's next year and it is quite apparent to me that you all are speaking greek. I will definitely have to look up what you guys are talking about.
I do get the Speed and Kinetic Energy aspect of it, but spine, FOC and other terms I will have to do some research on it. Thanks though, good post.
|
|