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QDM
Aug 25, 2006 3:56:21 GMT -5
Post by cambygsp on Aug 25, 2006 3:56:21 GMT -5
**IF** more folks are killing older buck deer, then how can there be **more older buck deer** in the herd? I don't get it
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QDM
Aug 25, 2006 6:40:08 GMT -5
Post by dec on Aug 25, 2006 6:40:08 GMT -5
I love how the spin doctors bring OBR into the QDM debate. OBR is not the same as QDM. It is possible to take advantage of the benefits from OBR and use these as a tool in the QDM equation, but the two are NOT one in the same. Spin spin spin, oops there goes yet another thread off topic and out of control.
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QDM
Aug 25, 2006 6:45:09 GMT -5
Post by js2397 on Aug 25, 2006 6:45:09 GMT -5
What is considered a big buck? I would think any buck that would make it into the state record book, I believe the minimum is 140", would be considered a trophy by anyone. I would guess there are at least 50 to 100 deer in any county that would reach that mark. Now if you are talking world record class 200"+ deer I would think there are only a handful in the country.
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QDM
Aug 25, 2006 21:17:22 GMT -5
Post by gillslayer on Aug 25, 2006 21:17:22 GMT -5
QDM does it work yes, OBR does it work YES, I have seen and help score bucks for the last three years and OBR does work and you can see that it does if you just open you eyes and look instead of putting on post after post about how it does not work. If you do not want it to work then there is nothing anyone can say to change that. All I say is go to the places where they are scoring deer and you will see the different.
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QDM
Aug 25, 2006 21:24:30 GMT -5
Post by indianahick on Aug 25, 2006 21:24:30 GMT -5
You have a 6 point that is 3.5. What are you going to do?
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QDM
Aug 25, 2006 21:40:53 GMT -5
Post by racktracker on Aug 25, 2006 21:40:53 GMT -5
DEC,
You are the very first pro-OBR guy that I have seen that has posted that the OBR was not QDM. Maybe the constant saying by the pro-OBR people that the OBR IS QDM is one reason why every QDM thread turns into an OBR thread??
To me - QDM = Good and OBR = Bad
Gillslayer,
Nobody said that there weren't big bucks being killed. How we got there is a matter of debate, discussion and concern.
I would say that we all are little bit right and a little bit wrong.
I do find it perplexing that most (not all) anti-OBR hunters will give the OBR some credit, but the pro-OBR hunters say it is ALL to the OBR's credit.
Nature doesn't work that way.
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QDM
Aug 27, 2006 7:49:15 GMT -5
Post by greghopper on Aug 27, 2006 7:49:15 GMT -5
I Really don't think its worth trying to explain...people seam to want to just twist things up....and if you Don't Think the OBR has had any Affect on the DEERS then that says it ALL....lol You cannot deliver ANY data to validate your claim that the OBR has made any impact at all to the buck numbers or maturity in Indiana. Zero. Here you go!!!!
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QDM
Aug 27, 2006 7:55:26 GMT -5
Post by racktracker on Aug 27, 2006 7:55:26 GMT -5
You cannot deliver ANY data to validate your claim that the OBR has made any impact at all to the buck numbers or maturity in Indiana. Zero. Here you go!!!! Thanks. That sure shows that the bowhunters gave up the bucks for the gun hunters to shoot. Killing more bucks now than we did under a 2 buck rule, so what did we "save"?? NADA..
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QDM
Aug 27, 2006 7:55:44 GMT -5
Post by greghopper on Aug 27, 2006 7:55:44 GMT -5
This just cracks me up. Really I cant speak for the entire state, but up here in the north, it has made a difference. What you`re suggesting isn`t possible. For starters, the number of hunters who "double dipped", took 2 bucks per year, was a modestly small number. Additionally, if you view harvest numbers, the same number of bucks are being killed now as before the OBR, just at a different harvest timeline. The OBR has made zero impact on the deer herd, and you have no data to support your claim, because data doesn`t exist. Or maybe This.......
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QDM
Aug 27, 2006 9:11:32 GMT -5
Post by huxbux on Aug 27, 2006 9:11:32 GMT -5
I Really don't think its worth trying to explain...people seam to want to just twist things up....and if you Don't Think the OBR has had any Affect on the DEERS then that says it ALL....lol If the states deer biologists have taken the position that the OBR experiment has produced no conclusive data, explain how you have come to this conclusion? Only a return to a more liberal buck harvest will provide the necessary data to compare to the OBR year figures. Without the proper scientific evidence, we are left only with yet another example of junk science. An awful lot of that around these days, I'm afraid.
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QDM
Aug 27, 2006 12:05:32 GMT -5
Post by racktracker on Aug 27, 2006 12:05:32 GMT -5
Greg,
Looks like the big jump was in 2002. Maybe a 100 or so? Where did those big bucks come from? Pre-OBR?
The ONLY thing that your chart shows is that people REGISTERED more bucks. Not that people killed more bucks. .
What percentage of qualifying bucks killed every year are never entered in any book? If only a small percentage of these people decide to enter their bucks then a pretty large swing can be made.
Do you not believe that a lot of hunters are becoming more "trophy conscious? Look at all the big buck magazines, videos and TV s hunting shows. The deer hunting emphasis is now all on big antlered bucks. One reason that we were stuck with the OBR to begin with.
That is why record books are not dependable as sources of deer ages
The IDNR age data (See the IDNR website) pretty well points out the age shifts and trend started well before the OBR came into being. Even our deer biologist says that is so.
Even your data from 2002 points that out very vividly - if one is to believe that record books are a good indicator of an aging deer population. Me? I'll take the good science offered by the IDNR over record books any day of the week.
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QDM
Aug 27, 2006 14:24:59 GMT -5
Post by indianahick on Aug 27, 2006 14:24:59 GMT -5
Lets try this one on for size as one of the biggest impacts on the growth of the Indiana herd. More and more farmers stopping hunting because of clowns with huge mud tires driving through their fields and making big ruts. I know one farmer that shut down all hunting on his property and they one I hunt on says you can hunt but you have to park by the barn. And can not drive anything Thur my fields including a quad.
OBR does not equal QDM. One is a restriction or bag limit if you want to call it that. The other is a quest for larger bodied, healthier deer.
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