|
Post by boonechaser on Sept 6, 2017 20:45:14 GMT -5
Personally I try to have all removed 30 days prior to bow opener.
|
|
|
Post by jackryan on Sept 6, 2017 21:32:34 GMT -5
As far as area and officer discretion. Was told by a co that if a deer was killed in an area that it's movement was influenced by the bait then you are in that area. As far as the neighbors putting out bait so you can't hunt, the answer was if you have or should have knowledge that bait is in the area, you are in the wrong. These are the grey areas. Didn't know it was there. Is that a defense? Couldn't tell you how many bait piles I've found on neighboring properties of the farm I hunt. Never called a co. Doubt any were going to walk in that far to investigate and in all honesty some of these bait piles could be construed that I was hunting "over" them. Honestly I've hunted near them but never set up thinking, going to get one going to that pile. Honestly before I wrote this out, never crossed my mind. Know where I'm hunting this year. The absurdity of it is they are all corn and are within 100 yards as the crow flies to corn fields. Most never seen much corn ate off them. Nothing here is intended specifically toward you. It's just your post is so close to my own situation I kind of want to use it as a jumping off place. My DIFFERENCE is I hunt about 50% of the time on public land in HNF AND I see a lot of low life poachers and their set ups. I see these because liars and poachers are looking for the same thing I'm looking for, deer and big deer. Most of the time the low life lives in the house NEAREST TO THE BAIT PILE/FEEDER AND they have a path as plain as day leading straight to their feeder almost every single time. More times than not a 4 wheeler ATV trail because those feeders hold and use a lot of corn and A LOT OF CORN is heavy and it's got to be refilled a lot. You see an ATV trail in an odd place on HNF and don't seem to really connect with any of the other big walking or horse trails and 9/10 times there is a big corn feeder, a trail cam, and a tree stand at one end or the other of it. If you know the ground and know the direction to the nearest house they you instantly know which way it is to the low life cheaters poaching hole. The other difference is, I turn those low life in to any one of the 3 or 4 game wardens I have stored in my telephone and send them the GPS coordinates and most of the time pictures and descriptions. I'll waste a day walking him straight out there to it and show him the guys house and how to get there with out being seen if he wants me to. What does that accomplish, it screws me out of hunting an area I've probably spent 5 or 6 days or more scouting. Learning if there is any thing there I want to hunt it and that means that's 6 days I don't get to scout someplace else. Who knows if you count time driving around looking for places not loaded down with nit wits from Indianapolis before I ever get out of the truck to walk a little. If it was just plain old "DON'T FEED THE WILD ANIMALS FROM THIS MONTH TO THAT MONTH" That low life would get a ticket in one trip by the CO, any time of the day or night, any of those days of any of those months. He would have to sit there for days waiting to catch him in the act of shooting. All this is a complete aside to the fact IT IS BAD FOR THE RESOURCE TO FEED WILD ANIMALS AND HAVE THOSE BAIT PILES SITTING OUT IN THE WOODS. Any where. You know we do have those giant rat trash roaming southern Indiana and nothing makes a hog problem in to an unstoppable nightmare faster than a corn pile. Nothing spreads disease faster through the wild deer herd than bumping noses day after day in a corn pile. Liars, cheats, people who can't hunt, have to bait. That is a fact.
|
|
|
Post by thebellcompany on Sept 7, 2017 6:46:34 GMT -5
I hunt public also. There's no gray area for me. Last year I found a "hole" in the ground where the deer destroyed the earth, 5 trails leading to that "hole" and a fresh tree stand right above it. Oh the date was sept 15th. It left a sour taste in my mouth realizing it was so close to my prime stand. Private land guys, just hunt a food plot. And I believe the reg's are clear about the infected "area" it is talking about a hunting area and a non-hunting area if there are deer in your area. Don't bait. Don't put out mineral. At least from late January till September 1st. Be smart not the other one. Dig a water hole, make a mock scrape. It's simple and a lot of fun staying away from away from illegal activities. If you can see your neighbors bait pile from your own property and you're in season report it. And I agree this is the best forum out there
|
|
|
Post by tynimiller on Sept 12, 2017 8:50:20 GMT -5
And so another case begins. We knew most likely this was going to happen when a neighbor to our one place moved in...I had a few hunting friends that knew him and they warned us as well.
So landowner of land we hunt has been keeping eye. Last week right along fence line in the woods (3 feet or so as described) he hung a stand, put out a salt block 20 feet from stand.
So now I knowing about this intended infraction (no law has been broken yet though to be fair and clear) I will be taking photos, labeling a map and getting all of this to the local CO. He will know the property of the stand and approximate location of block, where our nearest stands are and how he can access through the timber the easiest way to approach the spot if he should ever choose to in the future.
No, he will not be able to do a thing. No, he most likely will not waste days on end trying to catch this guy in the act...however I personally feel it is a sportsman's duty to not only do what I'm doing but even beyond that I care far too much about my hunting rights that I do not want anything coming back on my father or I. The CO knows where I hunt, if he was made aware or discovered this happening I know he'd ask if I knew...I never want him to have any reason to doubt me or my father.
If everything we've been made aware of holds true, we are monitoring that spot heavily with trail cameras and will continue to do so...sad fact we have to do it anyways but it is what it is.
|
|
|
Post by tynimiller on Sept 12, 2017 9:17:39 GMT -5
Just a heads up. We are going to be giving the guy a courtesy message or call just to discuss and let him know we are aware and understand no law has been broken yet but we will have to let CO know as we do not want any issues with the CO if for some reason he discovered it and we never made him aware as we've had numerous issues and DNR have at times utilized the property to attempt to stop poaching/trespassing on ours and the state ground to the south (protected wildlife marsh)
|
|
|
Post by jackryan on Sept 12, 2017 14:58:52 GMT -5
If I wanted to hunt it BEFORE, I'd hunt it. Just the same as I would if I knew or not. I'm NEVER going to let liars, poachers and cheats run me off a place I have every right to be hunting just because they are low lifes.
The law better get on it if they want it stopped.
Just stop baiting period. STOP feeding wild animals. They are WILD, not pets. Keep 'em that way.
|
|
|
Post by span870 on Sept 12, 2017 15:37:40 GMT -5
Bait is considered any product that is transported into a hunting area and placed there for animal consumption.
Just to go way off the deep end and stretch it as far as one humanly can, couldn't this be construed as a food plot? Not that a co ever would but on a technicality...
|
|
|
Post by Woody Williams on Sept 12, 2017 15:55:28 GMT -5
Bait is considered any product that is transported into a hunting area and placed there for animal consumption. Just to go way off the deep end and stretch it as far as one humanly can, couldn't this be construed as a food plot? Not that a co ever would but on a technicality... Yep, growing bait doesn't count..
|
|
|
Post by jackryan on Sept 12, 2017 19:04:15 GMT -5
Bait is considered any product that is transported into a hunting area and placed there for animal consumption. Just to go way off the deep end and stretch it as far as one humanly can, couldn't this be construed as a food plot? Not that a co ever would but on a technicality... No, because it is specifically spelled out that it is NOT considered baiting in the regulations.
|
|
|
Post by span870 on Sept 12, 2017 19:28:57 GMT -5
Bait is considered any product that is transported into a hunting area and placed there for animal consumption. Just to go way off the deep end and stretch it as far as one humanly can, couldn't this be construed as a food plot? Not that a co ever would but on a technicality... No, because it is specifically spelled out that it is NOT considered baiting in the regulations. Where in the regulations do you find it spelled out. I've looked and can't find a whole lot more than what I've written. Again, I'm just arguing for the sake of arguing about baiting and food plots. Don't care one way or the other. Does the actual ic code spell it out. Know no way that a co could ever make it stick, just thought it was interesting.
|
|
|
Post by thebellcompany on Sept 12, 2017 20:02:13 GMT -5
"Bait is considered any product that is TRANSPORTED into a hunting area and placed there for animal consumption. Baits can be in the form of salt, mineral blocks, prepared solid or liquid, or piles of apples or other food that is intended for the animal to eat." Part 1 definition of bait = 1. ANYTHING transported in. (Trans-ported literally means "across" "carried" in English that means carried in using your hands, your truck, your pack, etc. last time I checked I concluded that it is impossible to carry or move a food plot by hand, by truck, by pack etc) therefore if you plant a field by putting seed under the earth where the deer cannot get to it and it grows into a new plant, you have not transported bait. So, bait is anything you have to literally carry in by hand, place above ground and the animals can eat it. Part 2. It has to be edible to animals. And since this hunting regulations is located in the deer hunting section under "fair chase" of deer that means if a deer can eat it by putting it in its mouth, swallowing and digesting that is considered bait because it is edible. (Edible means eat-able) Part 3 describes examples of illegal bait. Hope that helps. It is easy to understand if you try hard and believe in yourself. God bleas
|
|
|
Post by span870 on Sept 12, 2017 20:12:39 GMT -5
You show me where at any point it says food plots are the exception. Anywhere. It doesn't. I carry a 50 pound bag of corn into a plowed field and dump it out, it's baiting. If I put that corn an inch under the ground, it's a food plot. I can spread it out over a half acre. I can "plant" my corn plot in November if I want and it's still a food plot? When's the cut off between baiting and food plot? What if I "plant" my plot two days before turkey season and hunt turkey over it? The field around where I hunt aren't even turned under by turkey season but hey, it's my food plot. Even if legal, I'd never hunt over bait but the more I read into this the more vague it actually is. What exactly you planting the food plot for? Want the deer to look at it. That seed mysteriously arrived there or you carry it in?
|
|
|
Post by thebellcompany on Sept 12, 2017 20:23:02 GMT -5
This is a simple answer: hunting regulations don't say the words "the exception to the transporting bait rule is to plant a food plot" is because food plots are not considered transporting bait so they're not even part of the conversation. If food plots were illegal there would be way too much controversy from agricultural farm land trying to determine case by case what is being harvested for human consumption. The dnr doesn't want that headache. Food plots are legal because no food is being transported in. It is legal to hunt next to a corn field it is legal to hunt next to a food plot. Agricultural field. Both legal.
|
|
|
Post by boonechaser on Sept 12, 2017 20:30:45 GMT -5
Very good explanation. In addition food plots/fields are used by alot of different wildlife and in my case of hay farming I use those fields for wildlife and hay production both clover and alfafa.
|
|
|
Post by Woody Williams on Sept 12, 2017 20:37:23 GMT -5
Food plot or baiting?
I saw this on a TV hunting show..
Mid December out west -
muzzleloader season
Standing Cornfield
First ten rows were bush hogged
Deer flocked in to the bush hogged rows.
BOOM on a huge buck..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2017 20:44:37 GMT -5
Food plot or baiting? I saw this on a TV hunting show.. Mid December out west - muzzleloader season Standing Cornfield First ten rows were bush hogged Deer flocked in to the bush hogged rows. BOOM on a huge buck.. Baiting! No difference than someone throwing the corn out. Just a bigger pile. So I can buy some corn stocks and corn ears, put in a row , and then bush hog and call it a food plot???
|
|
|
Post by boonechaser on Sept 12, 2017 21:23:46 GMT -5
Lol. Your killing me. Read the law in regards to baiting. It's really not that complicated and pretty easy to understand.
|
|
|
Post by jackryan on Sept 12, 2017 22:28:02 GMT -5
You show me where at any point it says food plots are the exception. Anywhere. It doesn't. I carry a 50 pound bag of corn into a plowed field and dump it out, it's baiting. If I put that corn an inch under the ground, it's a food plot. I can spread it out over a half acre. I can "plant" my corn plot in November if I want and it's still a food plot? When's the cut off between baiting and food plot? What if I "plant" my plot two days before turkey season and hunt turkey over it? The field around where I hunt aren't even turned under by turkey season but hey, it's my food plot. Even if legal, I'd never hunt over bait but the more I read into this the more vague it actually is. What exactly you planting the food plot for? Want the deer to look at it. That seed mysteriously arrived there or you carry it in? Go for it. My wife works at a state park. The women in the offices at state parks sell hunting licenses and have to deal with nitwits looking for a way to cheat all year long. They go on line and they argue the same ridiculous hypothetical and get laughed off the internet. If you seriously believed any of that you'd just do it, you wouldn't need to ask a thing because everyone else would be doing it. Or you'd just ask it in the Ask a CO forum. Just here and then they'll argue the same thing with some sales clerk in an office trying to get someone, just any one, to ok their hypothetical arguments. This is exactly what I tell her to say, what I'm telling you right here. Say it once. After that... What ever you say. Sounds like you know what you are doing, go for it. Tell it to the judge.
|
|
|
Post by jackryan on Sept 12, 2017 22:28:47 GMT -5
The Indiana regs are pretty close to this but I believe it leans more directly toward the exemption for standing crops and agricultural exemptions.
If someone feels strongly about it, look it up. I'm not a secretary and I'm not available for trial consultations or expert witness testimony. I just know what the rules are and I just follow them and hunt. I don't feel any need to skirt a technicality making up for inadequacy in hunting skills. Same reason I can hunt property lines and NEVER needed to chase wounded ones across the property lines or beg to go look for one. I've NEVER been talking to a property owner about one I lost, let alone talk about one and then have him point out my dead one "laying right over there. See that white belly all bloated up there..."
I'm a hunter not a lawyer. If it's on the line I'll put his eye out and scatter his brains on the property line while half is still where I can reach it to pull him back.
|
|
|
Post by swilk on Sept 13, 2017 6:57:42 GMT -5
I must be getting old...normally I like to play with folks that have such an attitude but anymore I'm content to just laugh and shake my head...
|
|