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Post by Woody Williams on Jun 11, 2016 20:02:00 GMT -5
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Post by swetz on Jun 11, 2016 22:06:43 GMT -5
Using my phone, but link doesn't take me to an article, but just a general field and steam page. I couldn't find the article.
I'm just going from the title since I couldn't find the article, but I think about it this way. An eagle is a bird. We kill billions of chicken and turkeys. Literally billions (mostly chickens). I wouldn't want to see any species go extinct, but if they're not taking enough to threaten the species, I don't take issue.
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Post by medic22 on Jun 11, 2016 23:46:14 GMT -5
I don't really know what to think. The article didnt include some details from the prior case that would help solidify my opinion. With the info given, if they are, and have been obtaining the proper permits, then I see no issue.
They are beautiful birds, and I hate to see any killed but, I dont write laws.
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Post by dbd870 on Jun 12, 2016 4:58:14 GMT -5
As long as the species is able to handle a certain amount of harvesting for that purpose I'm fine with the results.
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Post by Jamie Brooks 1John5:13 on Jun 12, 2016 5:30:41 GMT -5
If they can do it so can anyone else for religious ceremonies. Satan worshipers may want to kill babies in a religious ceremony ....Oh, I forgot the government doesn't care about killing babies.
Well, while I do like to protect religious freedoms, I'm not sure that I'd want to be sent away for life for being in possession of a feather when someone else can kill them, make a hat and dance around a fire.
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Post by stevein on Jun 12, 2016 7:18:51 GMT -5
If I understand the case right there are two tribes on the same reservation, one that needs to kill Eagles, the other opposed to it. This brought about the suit? Also it probably involves Treaty's too.
It looks like there are enough Eagles to maintain a population so I do not see a big problem.
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Post by trapperdave on Jun 12, 2016 7:52:52 GMT -5
Didn't read article...feeling lazy lol
Were they killed on the reservation? If so, isn't the reservation its own "country" so to speak? As in, nunya damn business federal gooberment?
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Post by Jamie Brooks 1John5:13 on Jun 12, 2016 8:47:45 GMT -5
Well, if the deer on my land belongs to our local government, then the eagles don't belong to the tribes either. We either have rules or we don't ..."Donald Trump."
I see a big mess coming here with millions of tax dollars being spent, convictions overturned...
I'm also not convinced killing eagles can be a "need."
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Post by swetz on Jun 12, 2016 10:27:44 GMT -5
Well, if the deer on my land belongs to our local government, then the eagles don't belong to the tribes either. We either have rules or we don't ..."Donald Trump." I see a big mess coming here with millions of tax dollars being spent, convictions overturned... I'm also not convinced killing eagles can be a "need." Different rules on Indian reservations as they are sovereign to set their own rules to a certain extent. I believe to what extent varies with their arrangements and agreements with the federal government. I don't really see the big deal as long as they're not over harvesting. Catholics got a pass during prohibition to have wine for mass. They still do really as they let people under 21 drink wine during communion. Ironically, the first religious freedom bill was passed to protect native americans from being prosecuted when using peyote in their traditional ceremonies. As far as what people "need" for their religion, that's a complex question that's best left alone as much as possible. As far as an patriotic concerns since they're the national bird, Ben Franklin wanted it to be the wild turkey. And we just had a whole discussion thread about shooting those. |
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Post by Jamie Brooks 1John5:13 on Jun 12, 2016 10:54:57 GMT -5
Well, if the deer on my land belongs to our local government, then the eagles don't belong to the tribes either. We either have rules or we don't ..."Donald Trump." I see a big mess coming here with millions of tax dollars being spent, convictions overturned... I'm also not convinced killing eagles can be a "need." Different rules on Indian reservations as they are sovereign to set their own rules to a certain extent. I believe to what extent varies with their arrangements and agreements with the federal government. I don't really see the big deal as long as they're not over harvesting. Catholics got a pass during prohibition to have wine for mass. They still do really as they let people under 21 drink wine during communion. Ironically, the first religious freedom bill was passed to protect native americans from being prosecuted when using peyote in their traditional ceremonies. As far as what people "need" for their religion, that's a complex question that's best left alone as much as possible. As far as an patriotic concerns since they're the national bird, Ben Franklin wanted it to be the wild turkey. And we just had a whole discussion thread about shooting those. Yep, I don't know what special arrangements they have, but obviously shooting them has been in question. I'm wondering how high in the air their agreement of sovereignty goes. Can they shoot down a drone, plane without question? I guess if we had as many eagles as turkeys, no one would really care. Well, it seems that I'm the only one who cares here. Now if they raised them in a pen and then hunted them maybe a few others would have a different opinion. My beef is that they don't own what flies over or crosses their property line, and if they can shoot them down, my neighbor should be able to too. I'm really tired of special rules for "special" folks. We're either all Americans or not. Sure we took their land, and they have the right to attempt to take it back. |
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Post by trapperdave on Jun 12, 2016 13:21:30 GMT -5
Special folk? They're a race nearly wiped to extinction. We took their land, called it ours and put them on reservations. The reservation are kinda like little countries within the US. Considering what they had vs what they have.....I say leave them the hell alone. Their "country" their rules.
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Post by Jamie Brooks 1John5:13 on Jun 12, 2016 16:13:45 GMT -5
Special folk? They're a race nearly wiped to extinction. We took their land, called it ours and put them on reservations. The reservation are kinda like little countries within the US. Considering what they had vs what they have.....I say leave them the hell alone. Their "country" their rules. LOL, Exactly what I'm talking about, rules that apply only to the average old fat white guy. This is what I call special, whether they're Indian, black, female, a cop, politician, someone who knows someone or whatever they are. Someone, thinks these groups or individuals are "special" and the rules don't apply ...because we owe them?  I know who they are and what our ancestors did to them. I'm saying this generation has paid enough. Let's all be equal! What happened to the Indians should be an example for us to NOT trust our government. "Here take these blankets; you look cold." ...after they disarmed them. To get a job at the post office, if you're white, you have to be smarter than a minority by a number of "special" given points. What makes anyone special??? Let's just be Americans!!! Professional sports has it right and we don't hear about whitey complaining about the disproportionate number of others. The owners are "allowed" to hire the best regardless of their race, religion or sexual preference. This DOES NOT apply in the real world. NO, we have to favor the special. I've been told that I had to hire a minority, and not necessarily the best for the job. So we feel sorry for what our ancestors did to the Indians? Well, I think enough time has passed to call it all even and let's just be Americans! When I saw the thread title, I thought the same, "Good for the Indians!" Then I thought about it with a rational mind separate from the emotional shame. My great, great, great, great, great, great, great granddaddy was a slave, so you owe me. Well, I'm confident that someone in my line was too! If anyone owes them, it's their kind; we paid for them. I don't think anyone is special except to their mother! We're Americans! How we got here is a moot point. Let's just be Americans and make it great again! |
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Post by stevein on Jun 13, 2016 10:30:04 GMT -5
These are treaties that were written long ago. Most have been upheld in court. That is why the Native Americans do not need the states permission to open casinos. I think they are the only group to lose a war with the USA that did not benefit.
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Post by Jamie Brooks 1John5:13 on Jun 13, 2016 12:38:37 GMT -5
These are treaties that were written long ago. Most have been upheld in court. That is why the Native Americans do not need the states permission to open casinos. I think they are the only group to lose a war with the USA that did not benefit. Wow, this is an interesting thought. I'd never thought about this. I'm still thinking about it. I wonder why there aren't more of them. Any ideas? My mind thinks that they should be the highest population of minority in America, but the numbers seem low. Not spending much time out west, I don't think that I've ever met a full blooded one. Now I'm wondering why they haven't migrated more to the east. Any ideas? |
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Post by stevein on Jun 13, 2016 18:37:32 GMT -5
N.A in Indiana would be mostly descendants of chiefs. They were given land in order to keep their people in line when the gov sent them west. The Miamis went to Oklahoma I think. My brother lives on land that was once White Loon's reserve in SW Allen Co. I live about 10 miles from Little Turtles village.
There are quite a few Reservations in Michigan.
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I know who they are and what our ancestors did to them. I'm saying this generation has paid enough. Let's all be equal!