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Post by Boilermaker on Aug 11, 2011 15:36:38 GMT -5
I've always hunted during the firearm season for deer but have never owned a muzzleloader. I'd like to sell my .44 mag and buy a muzzleloader but since i know nothing about them I figured I'd ask some people who do. Does anyone have any advice to someone new to the world of muzzleloading? I have no clue where to start on picking a muzzleloader, powder and anything else. Thanks!
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Post by hornharvester on Aug 11, 2011 16:53:49 GMT -5
Just about all the inline muzzle loaders will shoot good groups out to 200 yards. .50 caliber is the standard and easy to get load componets almost any where.
Brand is how much you want to spend. The cheaper guns still shoot good though.
I suggest you go to some stores and look and handle a few and decide what price range you want to buy.
For the beginner I suggest Pyrodex or Triple Seven pellets. They come in 50 grain size. Use 2, 50 grain pellets and a 250 T/C Shock Wave bullet/sabot. In most guns this combo shoots pretty good and is enough to take deer out to 150-175 yards.
Modern inline muzzleloaders use 209 primers. If you use T-7 powder make sure you buy the 209 primers made for it.
Basic muzzle loader operations is to dry fire a primer or two, dry swab the bore, load the powder, load the bullet/sabot and make sure the bullet is seated all the way down the bore. Put on the primer and "bang"!
If you know someone who shoots muzzleloaders have them help you get started. h.h.
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Post by countrystyle56 on Aug 11, 2011 18:46:10 GMT -5
TC ENCORE PRO HUNTER is my weapon of choice.
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Post by oldhoyt on Aug 12, 2011 5:56:30 GMT -5
I would start with a model that is known to shoot well with Blackhorn 209 powder. This powder eliminates the nasty fouling you'll get with black powder and most substitutes. It cleans just like a centerfire gun.
Next, I'd try Hornady FPB bullets as my first bullet. They work great for me and put the hurt on deer. Blackhorn does especially well with heavier bullets, so I'd try the 350 grain FPBs first. Aside from terminal performance, FPBs offer another advantage and that is they do not use sabots, they are full-bore projectiles. This takes a major variable out of the muzzleloading equation.
My last advice is don't sell the 44. Selling guns is a sin.
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Post by HighCotton on Aug 12, 2011 7:19:59 GMT -5
I agree with h.h. here - especially the advice to find someone with experience to help you get started. I prefer Thompson Center. This will be my 15th season with the Encore and I've owned/hunted/shot the Omega, Triumph, and Impact, too. So far I've found them all to be good and TC has been great on customer service and advice. I'd highly recommend the Impact - great starter ML, won't break the bank (typically under 3 bills), good lil tack driver, and also carrys the lifetime guarantee.
Keep in mind-this is just my opinion based on experience. Others have had as good of luck with competitive brands - as in the latest Savage ML's. Have an open mind and gain knowledge through your search.
If it could work out, I'd be happy to work out a time to show you the ropes on my Encore. I'm on the south side of Indy - just shoot me a PM.
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Post by stevein on Aug 12, 2011 10:43:05 GMT -5
All of the above advice is great. There are so many variables that it will boggle the mind. Horn Hunters advice to hook up with someone with experience is great.
There is the traditional side of muzzle loading too. Guns from matchlocks to caplocks are available and are great fun to hunt with, shoot and compete if you so desire. Also due to the popularity of inlines these traditional rifles can be found at very good prices. There is a learning curve too especially if you choose a flintlock.
On the used market I would look for an older CVA Mountain Rifle. I have seen them for $100 to $250.
TC Hawken or Renegade. $100 to $350 You can upgrade these with a Green Mountain drop-in round ball barrel that will shoot with anything out there. And many more.
The cost to shoot traditional rifles is much lower than most pellet / sabot combos and a .45, .50 or .54 round ball will harvest any deer in Indiana.
Plus they look a whole better than the inlines do.
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Post by inrecordbookbuck on Aug 15, 2011 9:14:20 GMT -5
Thompson center all the way..... if you are not going to use center fire barrels, there is no need to spend the extra cash on the Encore. I have one and wish i had saved the extra money i spent on it.....I will never use any other barrels with it so, there was no need to spend the extra cash....
If just starting out the new TC impact is a great gun..... if you have the extra dough to start out the triumph is by far the best ML out, imho.... followed by the omega.
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Post by Boilermaker on Aug 15, 2011 10:15:43 GMT -5
Thanks for all the great info...and oldhoyt as far as the .44 goes i'll be sure and keep it; I traded a gun one time for another and there's been many times I wish I still had it! I have always read and heard good things about TC and have considered buying the Encore just so I can get some other barrels but who knows. Thanks again everyone!
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Post by inrecordbookbuck on Aug 15, 2011 11:12:47 GMT -5
One thing I have thought about lately that my encore, is nice for...... I am thinking of buying a 15" .270 barrel and the pistol stock set. beings, i found out that is legal hunting gear in Indiana.
Just dont understand why it is illegal to hunt with a .270 rifle but if you have a pistol capable of firing a hi power rifle round, it is perfectly legal..... Does not make sense to me.
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Post by Boilermaker on Aug 15, 2011 12:21:37 GMT -5
Yeah that doesn't make much sense at all...definitely something to consider. Is any rifle round (w/in reason) allowed for deer hunting?
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Post by hornharvester on Aug 15, 2011 13:03:01 GMT -5
One thing I have thought about lately that my encore, is nice for...... I am thinking of buying a 15" .270 barrel and the pistol stock set. beings, i found out that is legal hunting gear in Indiana. Just dont understand why it is illegal to hunt with a .270 rifle but if you have a pistol capable of firing a hi power rifle round, it is perfectly legal..... Does not make sense to me. Actually it is illegal to do that. If the gun was made a rifle at the factory you are not suppose to make it into a pistol. I doubt any one would check you out but you never know who is listening. h.h. |
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Post by inrecordbookbuck on Aug 15, 2011 13:13:51 GMT -5
that is not how the Indiana Code reads.... could you point it out to me? as in is that in a code or law? i have not read that anywhere and have went through the section very close.
IC 35-47-1-6
"Handgun"
Sec. 6. "Handgun" means any firearm:
(1) designed or adapted so as to be aimed and fired from one (1) hand, regardless of barrel length; or
(2) any firearm with:
(A) a barrel less than sixteen (16) inches in length; or
(B) an overall length of less than twenty-six (26) inches.
#1 designed or adapted to be fired by one hand.... if i change out my stock set (adapted) a pistol grip and then follow part 2a and 2b........ i have a pistol according to indiana code... as for hunting with a pistol legal weapons read:
Handguns, other than muzzleloading, must have a barrel at least four inches long and must fire a bullet of .243-inch diameter or larger. The handgun cartridge case, without the bullet, must be at least 1.16 inches long. Full metal-jacketed bullets are not permitted.
So, i could use a .243 or anything larger to legally take a deer. there are 30-06 barrels for the encore that are 15" as well.
You would still have to be a LTCH holder to legally carry the gun for hunting.
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Post by hornharvester on Aug 15, 2011 16:24:09 GMT -5
I believe we had this discussion on here a couple years ago and its a federal law. Federal law trump state law. To legally change it over you are suppose to buy a $200.00 stamp from the BATF. I personally wouldnt worry about it but by law you cant make a pistol out of a rifle unless you buy the stamp. If the gun started out at the factory a rifle then it is illegal to make it into a handgun. Let me do some research and I will get back to you.
Im sure Dave knows so I hope he chimes in. h.h.
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Post by hornharvester on Aug 15, 2011 16:35:01 GMT -5
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Post by inrecordbookbuck on Aug 15, 2011 18:02:55 GMT -5
wonder if i need to resubmit some questions beings mine was manufactured as a muzzleloader....lol. just send us your 200.00....... that is hilarious... the encore platform was designed specifically for this purpose..... don't understand how then, they do do require the stamp at purchase. In this case changing it to anything should be and probably is...... you know shotgun to muzzleloader to rifle..... Always about money with the government.
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Post by oneshot on Aug 16, 2011 15:01:59 GMT -5
50 cal. T/C Omega
1.5-5X T/C scope
100 gr. Blackhorn 209
250 gr. T/C Shockwave [Hornady SST]
1/2" 3 shot group at 50yds. Off the bench
1" group at 100yds. Off the bench.
Works for me.
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Post by schoolmaster on Aug 16, 2011 19:09:19 GMT -5
Those doggone Omegas shoot better then they ought to for the money.
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Post by stevein on Aug 16, 2011 19:44:40 GMT -5
I think the receivers of Encores also apply to the federal law regardless of whether they shipped with a ML barrel or a cartridge barrel. Makes a difference if you sell to felon or someone prohibited from owning a firearm. Also affects cross state line transfers.
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Post by inrecordbookbuck on Aug 23, 2011 20:28:48 GMT -5
Please read this, the guy ask questions 1-5 and the BATF gave their answer in the three links and it is illegal to turn your Encore rifle into a pistol. Like I said early I wouldnt worry to much about it as I doubt anyone other than you would know. Sorry, h.h. i36.tinypic.com/2cdy6bc.jpgi37.tinypic.com/2dinc42.jpgi37.tinypic.com/6p54xe.jpgIn the case of United States v. Thompson/Center Arms Co. (1992), the U.S. Supreme Court ruled in the company's favor by deciding that the rifle conversion kit that Thompson sold with their pistols did not constitute a short-barreled rifle under the National Firearms Act of 1934.[7] The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms contended that the mere possession of a pistol, having a barrel less than sixteen inches (406 mm) long, with a shoulder stock and rifle-length (more than sixteen inches) barrel constituted constructive intent to "make" an illegal short-barreled rifle (by combining the pistol's frame, the pistol-length barrel, and the shoulder stock). This decision clarified the meaning of the term "make" in the National Firearms Act by stating that the pistol had to be assembled with a barrel less than 16 inches (410 mm) long with a stock directly attached to it to constitute a short-barrelled rifle under the National Firearms Act, and that the mere possession of components that theoretically could be assembled in an illegal configuration was not in itself a violation, as long as the components could also be assembled into legal configurations.[8] |
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Post by jgrimm on Aug 30, 2011 20:32:04 GMT -5
As long as it says TC on it you can't go wrong.
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