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Post by cambygsp on Oct 6, 2009 7:41:16 GMT -5
If the OBR was a "NEW" proposal today.....it would pass?
What I am getting at is the fact that so many more sporting folks are now connected to the internet and so many more offer input to the IDNR through the internet.
The youth season buck is a prime example of what sporting folks want versus what organized groups want.
I just glanced over the comments from the youth season buck, but it appears that the only oppisition was from organized hunting groups......................go figure!
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Post by Woody Williams on Oct 6, 2009 7:50:19 GMT -5
Who knows.. we can play "what if's" forever.
I did not see any mention of "organized hunting groups"?? Only input from individuals.
IMO - The internet has changed the playing field considerably. Information is getting out that never got out before and input is given back in a matter of minutes instead of a long drive to INDY..
We are all better for it..
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Post by jackc99 on Oct 6, 2009 11:40:22 GMT -5
The youth season buck is a prime example of what sporting folks want versus what organized groups want. Woody has it correct. No organized group stood up and opposed the youth antlered proposal. In fact several groups stood up and supported it...I know mine did. Only individuals within groups opposed the proposal and it passed anyway. As far as the OBR...who knows? It has a couple of years left then I suspect it will go away. Jack |
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Post by freedomhunter on Oct 6, 2009 12:19:17 GMT -5
unless something changes, the way we are headed, in a couple more years this country will be a different place and state deer regs will be the least of our worries.
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Post by 36fan on Oct 6, 2009 21:41:13 GMT -5
From talking to a CO last year, the doe only for youth was to prevent poacher 'Dad's' from shooting a buck early and saying their kid shot it. While it may be a legitimate concern, the innocent children shouldn't have been punished over the possibility of individuals manipulating and abusing the system. But, it's also my understanding that KY has had issues with 8 and 10 year old kids supposedly shooting bucks with .30-06 rifles and 12 gauge shotguns during their youth only hunts. Oh well, I'm sure it's destined to happen up here, too...
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Post by jackc99 on Oct 6, 2009 21:56:22 GMT -5
Actually your CO friend is wrong. The idea for the youth season was as a recruitment tool and it originally included the antlered deer. DNR management thought it would be easier to sell it as a herd management tool if we made it anterless to start so that's what happened. As of last week that has been corrected to the original proposal for any deer.
Jack
P.S. What IDEM Division do you work in?
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Post by cambygsp on Oct 7, 2009 3:47:52 GMT -5
www.in.gov/nrc/files/Item_13_september_2009.pdfFrom Page 7 "Joe Bacon, (Indiana Deer Hunters Assoc.), Marion, Indiana (email: April 1, 2009) Please keep the youth hunt as an antlerless season only. We need to give youth a chance to hunt in a special season, but they also have the regular season to buck hunt like all other hunters. When the season was created it was for an opportunity for an adult and youth to hunt together, the idea was to teach youth it is ok to shoot a doe. If the youth kills a buck during the early season it maybe difficult to motivate that youth to antlerless hunt later in the regular seasons. The youth could be tired from other activities, or the weather is cold. We all realize how fickle a youth can be. As we proposed and created this rule (yes I was involved) we had a reason to make it antlerless only, we created a season structure that almost assured the youth would be out again with their mentor in the same year hunting for that "buck". Don’t be fooled by those who say we did not want youth killing "our bucks". It was a very well planned hunt, involve and hook the youth on hunting, then get him/her out again in a regular season." The way I read this is that the IDHA opposed the addition of the buck to the youth season.
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Post by jackc99 on Oct 7, 2009 11:54:17 GMT -5
Regardless of what he wrote Joe was speaking for Joe. You were at the meeting. The board of directors of IDHA did not commit either way. Also, Joe came in on the end of the rule AFTER we had created it. He was not privvy to the 3 months of meetings leading up to the one he attended. The 3 groups involved in creating the youth season were the Safari Club, The Indianapolis Flycasters, and Pheasants Forever. The IDHA was not on the team. Kind of odd  ? Jack |
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Post by DEERTRACKS on Oct 7, 2009 12:01:52 GMT -5
If the OBR was a "NEW" proposal today.....it would pass? What I am getting at is the fact that so many more sporting folks are now connected to the internet and so many more offer input to the IDNR through the internet. The youth season buck is a prime example of what sporting folks want versus what organized groups want. I just glanced over the comments from the youth season buck, but it appears that the only oppisition was from organized hunting groups......................go figure! Hopefully not!  |
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Post by ridgerunner on Oct 8, 2009 14:08:59 GMT -5
And now you're speaking for Joe ...jackc99..Who really cares about who spearheaded what?
<EDIT>
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Post by jackc99 on Oct 8, 2009 15:55:40 GMT -5
I guess you're right. Joe can speak for himself. He wasn't at the meetings. IDHA was not involved until the end. As an organization they did not oppose the antlered deer proposal. End of story. Better?
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Post by vectrix on Oct 8, 2009 19:21:15 GMT -5
I am sort of new to this whole forum - computer thing. I remember the first year I could take my son out during the youth season and he connected on a doe the first day. I don't remember him complaining or me being upset because it was only a doe. Is it the youth complaining about this rule or their parents? Same as the OBR, if you don't have the wi ll power to hold off, then don't. If you have taken your share of scrubs then I think it is great that you have to exibit some restraint, makes for a better season. If its the "Meat argument" then take some does. These are just opinions but I believe doe or buck most youth do not care and we as adults should emphasize that it doesnt matter either.
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Post by Woody Williams on Oct 8, 2009 19:29:15 GMT -5
I.........These are just opinions but I believe doe or buck most youth do not care and we as adults should emphasize that it doesnt matter either. That is just it... it shouldn't matter. Let them make a choice and 9 times out of 10 it will be the first deer in shooting range that they will lay down.. |
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Post by ridgerunner on Oct 8, 2009 20:06:03 GMT -5
Why can't a youth shoot a buck during regular season? I feel like it many fathers would be shooting bucks for thier kids to tag...It happens now..will the youth be able to harvest a second deer during regular season too or will the one early count as thier one buck?
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Post by cambygsp on Oct 8, 2009 20:40:34 GMT -5
Not trying to start an argument but Joe Bacon himself has told me on several occasions that when he puts the (IDHA) next to his name he is speaking for the IDHA.
When he just puts (Joe Bacon) he is speaking for himself!
I take it that the comment he made for the youth season buck is from the IDHA!
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Post by gundude on Oct 8, 2009 20:50:58 GMT -5
And now you're speaking for Joe ...jackc99..Who really cares about who spearheaded what? <EDIT>Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Camby, go take up your beef with Joe or IDHA or IBA or Doug or Dave on a level playing field instead of hiding here....... I hope some of you kids grow up soon........ Jack was spot on on what he said. End of subject.. Now Go hunt. |
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Post by duff on Oct 8, 2009 20:51:28 GMT -5
Who cares who said what and who they speak for. I agree that times have changed since the OBR got pushed through and the visibility of proposed rule changes gets out to many more people. Not sure if it would have changed anything or not and don't really care since it is ancient history!
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Post by gundude on Oct 8, 2009 20:53:53 GMT -5
Well said duff
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Post by jackc99 on Oct 8, 2009 21:22:56 GMT -5
Why can't a youth shoot a buck during regular season? I feel like it many fathers would be shooting bucks for thier kids to tag...It happens now..will the youth be able to harvest a second deer during regular season too or will the one early count as thier one buck? The OBR applies. The youth get one buck a year just like everyone else. Jack |
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Post by cambygsp on Oct 9, 2009 4:11:20 GMT -5
I agree that times have changed since the OBR got pushed through and the visibility of proposed rule changes gets out to many more people. Gundude, This is what the thread is about........ Although Al Gore had already invented the internet when the OBR was pushed through (by organized hunting groups)......not that many sporting folks were connected to the internet like they are today. The reason I bring this up is because I interpeted that the IDHA felt that the youths should not be allowed to shoot a buck deer during the youth hunt.......because Joe had put the IDHA name in with his oppision comment. I have no beef with Joe, everyone is entitled to an opinion.........I do fell that it is odd that the IDHA claims to have the pulse of the Indiana Deer Hunter when there was so much overwhelming support for the youth season buck.....yet the IDHA opposed! |
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