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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 8, 2014 13:39:08 GMT -5
Saw on another forum that these bullets are delayed due to some problem, no idea what it is. Apparently they should be hitting stores (figuratively) by November. That will be too late for most guys I'd imagine. Maybe something to try next year though.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 8, 2014 13:23:59 GMT -5
I don't use trail cameras. About half of the spots I hunt are based on where deer will go when pressured. Also, I think a guy could get real discouraged if he had cameras up for a while and no good bucks on film. I'd rather be blissfully ignorant and stay in my stand hoping something good will come by. I hear pretty frequently on TV that guys shoot a buck they "had no idea" was on their property. So there's always a chance, regardless of what the camera says.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 8, 2014 13:09:10 GMT -5
I can hand-toss a 2" diameter washer with a 3/4" hole in the center to a height of 25 feet, and when the washer is at its highest point I can shoot my 22 rifle right through the center. Every time. I know I'm shooting dead center because the washer has never come down with a bullet mark indicating I even knicked it anywhere else. And yes, I can do this blindfolded.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 7, 2014 6:51:26 GMT -5
I know COs can enforce non-hunting laws. I've now asked the CO on the forum if he would issue tickets and under what circumstances. We'll see what he says. As used in relevant Indiana Code, "exert control over property" means to obtain, take, carry, drive, lead away, conceal, abandon, sell, convey, encumber, or possess property, or to secure, transfer, or extend a right to property. I know I'm not a lawyer, and I'm guessing the vast majority of COs are not either, but IMHO, sitting in someone else's stand would not meet the definition given above, assuming the person vacated the stand when asked. Yes it does clearly !!!! You do know what ENCUMBER and SECURE means right ?Let alone extend a right to property means don't you It is clear as can be it means stay out or get arrested if the owner wants to push the situation . So if a CO walks up on you in a stand that does not belong to you he can at that time if the owner did not convey permission or give written permission then ticket or arrest you .Man what kind of explanation do you need ?? It really does not matter if he leaves the stand or not he was not supposed to be there and it was securing the property or encumbering the hunters property right to begin with . I have no difficulties with reading comprehension but thanks for asking. Perhaps consulting a dictionary is a good idea though, since the two words selected out of the several used in the law to define what is considered "exerting control" don't really seem applicable to a situation where the interloper exits the stand upon request. To put it another way, to encumber the stand owner, the interloper must somehow burden, hinder, hamper, impede, get in the way, weigh down, etc., the stand owner. How does he do this if he leaves upon request? As for "secure", there are many meanings, but in reference to property it would be something along the lines of protecting or preserving property for one's self. Again, if the interloper leaves upon request, how did he secure the owner's stand? As for the owner wanting to "push the situation", I don't see where that's relevant. It is either legal or illegal to sit in another person's stand on public land without permission. I'm only trying to get at that issue. I realize in order for a ticket to be issued, someone would need to report it. I'm not advocating that anyone sit in another person's stand on public land. I'm asking questions to determine what is legal, and if that point requires interpretation and discretion, I'd at least like to know under what circumstances a CO would issue a ticket. I don't see why folks are getting riled up, as if someone asking questions that seem inconsistent with or challenging to someone else's "personal reality" could actually affect them in some way. As I noted in the other thread, Michigan's hunting digest clearly states that you cannot expect that others will not use your stand on public land. Indiana's digest doesn't say anything either way on the subject. And we've heard from the CO that there's no hunting regulation pertaining to the issue. So we default to other laws regarding property rights. I don't see the issue being "as clear as can be", beacuse if the law actually meant "stay out or get arrested", it would probably say just that.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 6, 2014 16:30:24 GMT -5
I know COs can enforce non-hunting laws. I've now asked the CO on the forum if he would issue tickets and under what circumstances. We'll see what he says.
As used in relevant Indiana Code, "exert control over property" means to obtain, take, carry, drive, lead away, conceal, abandon, sell, convey, encumber, or possess property, or to secure, transfer, or extend a right to property.
I know I'm not a lawyer, and I'm guessing the vast majority of COs are not either, but IMHO, sitting in someone else's stand would not meet the defintion given above, assuming the person vacated the stand when asked.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 6, 2014 12:54:11 GMT -5
Here is the CO's answer: "It would have to be used by someone the owner gave permission to. Just because it is placed on public land, legally and within all the regulations of statute and administrative rules, doesn't give someone the authority to exert unauthorized control over the item. This is not a hunting statute but would fall under conversion or exerting unauthorized control over property that belongs to another. If you are in the stand, you have pretty much taken control."
Based on the response, apparently there is no hunting regulation that pertains to the situation. I've asked the CO another question regarding the circumstances under which a CO could or would issue a ticket.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 6, 2014 12:47:30 GMT -5
Thanks for answering my question.
To put a different light on the question, I'd like to know under what circumstances a CO could or would issue a ticket to a person that was sitting in a stand on public land owned by another hunter.
Would a ticket be issued if the CO found the hunter in the stand, or, would a ticket only be issued if the hunter did not leave the stand at the request of the owner?
Thanks Again!
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 2, 2014 9:33:30 GMT -5
It will be interesting to see if the CO that addresses questions on this forum is consistent with what that CO told you. Not saying it's right, but I think that's what he'll say.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 2, 2014 8:37:31 GMT -5
So if you typically hunt a specific area and there is already a vehicle or two do you go running in because you put your stand there or do you head down to the next spot? I agree with Jack on this, if you put a stand up and expect no one will use them or avoid "your" area you are delusional. Go ahead and ruin your hunt, I don't have time to ruin my hunt so I find the next spot. To listen to you guys if you got to your stand and a guy was ten feet away in his climber who wins... The guy in the climber .. A hung stand does not reserve the spot... If I walked in and someone was in my stand I'd ask them politely to get down and move on. The decent thing for them to do would be to comply. If they didn't id go hunt elsewhere but would be back the next day to drop the stand. They would not hunt it a second time. The further back in that you walk to your stand the less likely anyone will be in it. Woody, do you know the rule/reg on this? On public land, is it lawful to sit in a properly hung stand that is not your own?
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 1, 2014 15:37:32 GMT -5
Dunno. I would hope the guy would just get out of the stand and move on. I can't imagine someone refusing to get down if the owner wanted to pull the stand.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 1, 2014 15:26:14 GMT -5
Neither.
I have stands in Michigan on public ground, and I know the regs there allow anyone to use stands, first come, first served.
I also have a stand in Indiana on private land, so i'm not concerned there. Reading the Michigan hunting digest got me wondering about the law in IN.
Based on what has been written in this thread so far, there is no concensus on what the IN regs allow.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 1, 2014 14:24:59 GMT -5
Would you feel the same way if another hunter set up a bunch of stands in an attempt to lay claim to a large area? Remember, this discussion is limited to public land. Nobody has more right to a spot than another. I think we all would try to be considerate of others, but unless I see orange,I'm going to hunt where I think I'll see deer. I won't avoid an area because there's already a stand there. I am in agreement BUT.......such is NOT sitting in another's STAND. Same area when they are NOT hunting on public ground is one thing. Sitting in another's stand is entirely a different matter, IMO. If accurate I know a quick cure. Don't use a stand. God Bless I was referring to the post which indicated it was simply good ethics to "steer clear" of another hunter's set-up. In that context, I won't abandon the place I want to hunt, just because I see a stand close by. If there's a hunter in the stand, I'll give him/her the consideration I would want to be given. Hopefully, the CO will answer my post soon. So far in this thread, we've heard that the stand cannot be used by others, and we've heard that it's first-come, first-served. Interesting conversation.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 1, 2014 13:14:52 GMT -5
Would you feel the same way if another hunter set up a bunch of stands in an attempt to lay claim to a large area? Remember, this discussion is limited to public land. Nobody has more right to a spot than another. I think we all would try to be considerate of others, but unless I see orange,I'm going to hunt where I think I'll see deer. I won't avoid an area because there's already a stand there.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 1, 2014 12:01:41 GMT -5
The reason I'm asking is because I don't see it stated one way or the other in the hunting digest.
FYI - Michigan's hunting digest clearly states that you cannot expect exclusive use of your stand on public land.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 1, 2014 11:10:14 GMT -5
I put this in the Ask the CO Forum as well, but figured I'd get some opinions here.
Assuming a treestand is placed on public hunting land according to the rules, is the stand open to anyone who wants to use it (first one to get there), or, can it only be used by the owner?
Thanks.
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Post by oldhoyt on Oct 1, 2014 10:50:16 GMT -5
Assuming a treestand is placed on public hunting land according to the rules, is the stand open to anyone who wants to use it (first one to get there), or, can it only be used by the owner? Thanks.
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Post by oldhoyt on Sept 30, 2014 7:21:23 GMT -5
Has anyone tried the new Federal ML bullet? They call it B.O.R. Lok or something like that. Full bore size copper bullet (50 cal, 270 gr) with a polymer cup that moves forward, slides over a rear portion of the bullet, which makes it increase in diameter to engage the rifling. Seems like an interesting system, but they are pricey from what I hear. Any reports?
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Post by oldhoyt on Sept 26, 2014 7:14:19 GMT -5
Headline says "hunting", but it's really a cull operation. Typical media. Folks will stopreading t the headline and get all riled up.
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Post by oldhoyt on Sept 24, 2014 11:26:20 GMT -5
Fixed your post: I probably use the words entitlement mentality all too often but unfortunately it usually fits. Want something without working for it or earning it. We aren't owed anything in this life other than a fair chance at success and a governemnt-issued cell phone. After that its up to us.
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Post by oldhoyt on Sept 19, 2014 7:50:37 GMT -5
Over 25 years ago, I was following a good track in the snow. Looked up ahead and saw another hunter coming my way on the same track. No matter what I said, I could not convince him that he was actually back-tracking.
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