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Post by drs on Aug 17, 2005 13:44:22 GMT -5
I just got off another Hunting Forum where someone from Indiana posted That the IDNR will require landowners to purchase Deer Tag and Hunting Licenses inorder to hunt on THEIR OWN PROPERTY. This means that the landowner will be required to purchase a General Hunting License and also Deer Hunting License(s) @ $24 per License/Tag. Just wonder if this is actually true? For Years many landowners, which I am one of them, have been permitted to hunt their property without purchasing a Hunting Licenses or Tag. All we had to do is fill out our own tag and take it along to the check station to be recorded. Now, it seems that if you own & live on your property; you have to buy a deer hunting license & Tag. I feel this is a very unfair requirement, as we pay propety taxes and also some of us have areas set aside to help the wildlife in the winter by planting food plots or setting out food. The only thing this is going to do is discourage more people who like to hunt and they'll stop hunting and close their property to others Hunters. THANKS "OUR MAN MITCH!!!
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Post by gundude on Aug 17, 2005 13:57:15 GMT -5
EASY ON MY MAN MITCH THERE drs. I was a little leery of his pick for director of DNR and it turns out Mr. Humpfer has done a lot for sportsmen so far.
The issue that you have brought up is the first I have heard about it...... Ill chk thier site and see if I learn more and I would suggest you do the same before we start bashing the administration.
I agree with you however about the land owners should be exempt as they always have been. Just need to get the TRUE facts first and then if WE don't like it there are courses of action to take to fight it.
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Post by Woody Williams on Aug 17, 2005 14:17:54 GMT -5
More than likely they got that from the rule proposal that the IDNR presented to the Natural resources Committee in July.
As I understand it the NRC approved all of these but wanted a revision in the landowner requirements that would protect family corperations - IE. the family farm owners.
I believe that as the rule stands today 5 or 6 guys could go together, form a corporation, buy or lease ground for the expressed purpose of hunting and them and their families could hunt for free forever.
I believe that is what the IDNR wants to head off.. this will not effect the family farmers.The IDNR proposals..Request for preliminary adoption of amendments to 312 IAC 9 concerning the following rules: taking, chasing and possessing wild animals; license exemptions for owners and lessees of farmland; deer hunting; hunting deer by firearms; trapping coyotes; bobcats; river otters; badgers; migratory birds; mute swans; wild turkey hunting; special purpose turtle possession permit; taxidermist license; fur buyer license; nuisance wild animal control permit, and wild animal possession permit. The Divisions of Fish and Wildlife and Law Enforcement recommend approval. Exhibit A: Draft of Revised Administrative Rules After intense review by DNR wildlife managers and law enforcement officers, the Division has proposed several rule changes. These changes are needed to provide additional clarification of our regulations, protection of our wildlife resources, and provide for better enforcement of current laws. The proposed changes are as follows: 1. Removes language that states that this article does not apply to groundhogs due to recent statutory changes. This would classify groundhogs as an "exempted wild animal" in 312 IAC 9-3-20 and no hunting license would be required to take them. 2. Clarifies the exemption for owners and lessees of farmland who are hunting without a license to apply only to those who reside on the land if the owner is a corporation, limited liability company or partnership.3. Removes language in deer regulations referencing the temporary transportation tag attached to a license because of the automated licensed system. Requires the piece of paper only. 4. Adds a provision for muzzleloaders that requires them to only be capable of being loaded from the muzzle - both powder and bullet. 5. Changes the time in which the coyote trapping season starts from noon to 8 a.m., the same as for trapping foxes. 6. Removes the bobcat, river otter and badger from the state's endangered species list, but still prohibits the taking of bobcats, river otters and badgers in Indiana. This proposal would allow their possession and sale only if lawfully acquired and with satisfactory documentation. By Indiana law, endangered species are any species of wildlife whose prospects for survival or recruitment within the state are in jeopardy or are likely to become so within the foreseeable future. While the badger, bobcat and river otter were all included on Indiana's original endangered species list in 1969, studies by DNR biologists throughout the past 10 years have shown a growing population of all three endangered species. Badgers have been documented in 82 counties; river otters are now recorded in 63 counties although the population remains highest in the areas where the releases took place, and recent studies on bobcats have confirmed their existence in 32 counties. 7. Exempts mute swans from registration with the Harvest Information Program (HIP) and requires landowners and lessees to register with the HIP before hunting a migratory bird. 8. Allows mute swans to be taken at any time, adds a provision to allow their possession live only if possessed in captivity and pinioned, and prohibits their sale. This rule proposal would grandfather those individuals who already have them prior to our new law. 9. Removes language in wild turkey regulations referencing the temporary transportation tag attached to a license because of the automated licensed system. Requires the piece of paper only. 10. Changes the expiration date for special purpose turtle possession permits to June 30 of each year (due to the fact that many individuals keep their pet box turtles outdoors and are in hibernation when the current permit expires) and allows another temporary form of unique identification instead of a PIT-tag. 11. Modifies the laws for licensed taxidermists to make sure that an animal possessed by a taxidermist is properly tagged, clarifies that copies of their reports must be provided to a conservation officer upon request, and allows a taxidermist possess a mute swan for another person without a federal permit. 12. Allows nuisance wild animal control permit holders to take mute swans. This would give permit holders the option of taking mute swans under this permit. 13. Modifies the fur buyer license requirements to allow licensed fur buyers to possess and sell bobcat, river otter and badger hides and carcasses with appropriate documentation and adds requirements for all receipts that are issued. 14. Modifies the wild animal possession permit to add bobcats to the housing specification requirements for small wild cats (page 17). Bobcats can already be possessed under a wild animal possession permit since they are an endangered species; this modification would simply clarify the housing requirements for conservation officers and permit holders. Draft #8 (July 11, 2005) www.in.gov/nrc/minutes/current_agenda/Item%203.doc
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Post by Woody Williams on Aug 17, 2005 14:21:19 GMT -5
The proposal that is being revised to make sure farm corporations are not caught up in it.
You don't have anything to worry about because you said that you "live on your ground"...
312 IAC 9-2-14 Fishing, hunting and trapping without a license by owners and lessees of farmland Authority: IC 14-22-6-1; IC 14-22-11-1 Affected: IC 14-22
Sec. 1. (a) An owner or a lessee of farmland and a family member of the owner or lessee, if exempted under IC 14-22-11-1, may fish, hunt, or trap on the farmland without obtaining a license under this article. (b) For farmland owned or leased by a corporation, limited liability company, partnership, or another person other than an individual or individuals, the license exemption applies only to an individual who resides on the farmland. (Natural Resources Commission; 312 IAC 9-2-14)
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 17, 2005 14:37:03 GMT -5
But Woody , he read it on the internet so it just has to be true ... ;D
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Post by drs on Aug 18, 2005 7:09:20 GMT -5
The proposal that is being revised to make sure farm corporations are not caught up in it.
You don't have anything to worry about because you said that you "live on your ground"...312 IAC 9-2-14 Fishing, hunting and trapping without a license by owners and lessees of farmland Authority: IC 14-22-6-1; IC 14-22-11-1 Affected: IC 14-22 Sec. 1. (a) An owner or a lessee of farmland and a family member of the owner or lessee, if exempted under IC 14-22-11-1, may fish, hunt, or trap on the farmland without obtaining a license under this article. (b) For farmland owned or leased by a corporation, limited liability company, partnership, or another person other than an individual or individuals, the license exemption applies only to an individual who resides on the farmland. (Natural Resources Commission; 312 IAC 9-2-14) So Woody, are you saying that I am exempt from purchasing a Hunting License or Deer tag?? I live on 15 acres of wooded property where I do most if not all of my hunting here in Indiana. It is NOT a farm just wooded acreage, so this this exemption still apply to me since I live on the 15 acres? I purchase a regular Hunting License each year as I feel I should contribute something to the DNR's cofffers. But I feel this is good enough for landowners and they should not have to purchase Deer or Turkey Licenses/Tag inorder to hunt on land they live on. The State is ALWAYS PREACHING that we have too many Deer and they seem to make it difficult for Hunter to thin out the herd to healthy levels.
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Post by drs on Aug 18, 2005 7:13:33 GMT -5
EASY ON MY MAN MITCH THERE drs. I was a little leery of his pick for director of DNR and it turns out Mr. Humpfer has done a lot for sportsmen so far. The issue that you have brought up is the first I have heard about it...... Ill chk thier site and see if I learn more and I would suggest you do the same before we start bashing the administration. I agree with you however about the land owners should be exempt as they always have been. Just need to get the TRUE facts first and then if WE don't like it there are courses of action to take to fight it. First: I didn't vote for "Our Man Mitch" and second , in my opinion, he is the worst governor we have had in recent years. I am a regestered Republican but I voted for the Libertarian, and my Sister even knows him!!!!!
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Post by gundude on Aug 18, 2005 7:17:40 GMT -5
Wont argue politics with ya drs........... Just sayin give the guy a chance thats all.
You can still hunt without buying a tag as I understand it.
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Post by Woody Williams on Aug 18, 2005 7:29:43 GMT -5
The proposal that is being revised to make sure farm corporations are not caught up in it.
You don't have anything to worry about because you said that you "live on your ground"...312 IAC 9-2-14 Fishing, hunting and trapping without a license by owners and lessees of farmland Authority: IC 14-22-6-1; IC 14-22-11-1 Affected: IC 14-22 Sec. 1. (a) An owner or a lessee of farmland and a family member of the owner or lessee, if exempted under IC 14-22-11-1, may fish, hunt, or trap on the farmland without obtaining a license under this article. (b) For farmland owned or leased by a corporation, limited liability company, partnership, or another person other than an individual or individuals, the license exemption applies only to an individual who resides on the farmland. (Natural Resources Commission; 312 IAC 9-2-14) So Woody, are you saying that I am exempt from purchasing a Hunting License or Deer tag?? I live on 15 acres of wooded property where I do most if not all of my hunting here in Indiana. It is NOT a farm just wooded acreage, so this this exemption still apply to me since I live on the 15 acres? I purchase a regular Hunting License each year as I feel I should contribute something to the DNR's cofffers. But I feel this is good enough for landowners and they should not have to purchase Deer or Turkey Licenses/Tag inorder to hunt on land they live on. The State is ALWAYS PREACHING that we have too many Deer and they seem to make it difficult for Hunter to thin out the herd to healthy levels. David, I think you would be home free. But if I were you I'd be sure an get a clarification on it from the IDNR...
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 18, 2005 9:26:52 GMT -5
Didn't Greendeem clarify this as saying that all landowners are generally exempt ? I seem to recall this from his forum at HH.com awhile back .
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Post by drs on Aug 18, 2005 9:48:45 GMT -5
Will do just that. Thanks, Woody!
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Post by dec on Aug 18, 2005 14:03:13 GMT -5
DRS - I was the guy that posted that info on the RT site. I wasn't trying to ruffle your feathers. I was just posting my interpretation of the proposed rule change. Just as all of this on here is an interpretation. What the suits in Indy end up doing, time will tell. Didn't Greendeem clarify this as saying that all landowners are generally exempt ? I seem to recall this from his forum at HH.com awhile back . This is pretty much exactly what I had heard from a Lagrange Co. officer. But does this mean that the guy that has a house sitting on a single acre of land can shoot a deer (in season of course) and drop it on his property and use a land owner tag? The officer I spoke to said "yes". He made sure to clarify that just because you shoot the deer on your property, does not mean you can use a land owner tag. He said if the deer leaves your property and dies, then you are no longer except under the land owner system. My question is, how is that considered "farm land" as stated in the IAC? I've always wondered about this loop hole in the licensing system. It seems there should be a better way to define who falls under the land owner tag system.
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 18, 2005 14:07:00 GMT -5
For reference , the 10 acres I live on is zoned agricultural/marginal for farming . I've been told by a bank loan officer that nearly all undeveloped land has this same zoning . That might explain it .
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Post by jkd on Aug 18, 2005 17:39:56 GMT -5
I asked one of the central office CO's about this a while back regarding hunting in a woods lot when it's the adjoining fields that are actually being "farmed"...
He indicated that the exemption is for hunting (a) land you own, or (b) land that you lease and farm.
Unless there has been a change by emergency rule, you can hunt on land you own without a license.
The rules clarification dealt with the definition of "ownership" relating to large groups as corporations owning property, but family farms that are incorporated are still supposed to be exempt...
KD
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Post by RiverJim on Aug 18, 2005 20:35:46 GMT -5
So can I give my neighbor (farmer) $4.00 to "lease" some land, plant some geraneums and be a farmer?
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Post by drs on Aug 19, 2005 7:44:11 GMT -5
Thanks Guys, for your posts. However, it is still very unclear as to if a person owns and lives on 15 acres of wooded ground and does not farm; is required to buy a Hunting License or Tags or is exempt from doing so Since 1997, I've been allowed to Deer hunt on my own 15 acres without buying a Deer Tag, but I do buy a General Hunting License. Before I set out to hunt back in '97 I called the IDNR Deer Hotline and asked about the License Requirement. The nice Lady told me I or anyone in my family would NOT be required to purchase a Deer Tag. The only thing, I had to do is make my own tag and take it along with the Harvested Deer to a check station for recording the harvest. NOW it seems they are changing rules (I Think) once again leaving many of us landowners confused about whether we are required to buy Deer Tags this year or in the future. If the State of Indiana wants to start charging Landowners then why not create a "Landowners License/Tag" for Deer or Turkey for like $10? I wouldn't be opposed to this.
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 19, 2005 9:42:05 GMT -5
I've gotten the wrong info in the past from "asking the nice lady who answered the phone" , I stick with what a CO or Law Enforcement Division tells me .
Hmmm ... Charging landowners to hunt on their own property ... I don't see that going over well even if it's a token amount . In fact , it could affect access for everyone else or cause the landowner to reconsider leasing . One of the biggest reasons I chose the home I currently live in was the fact that the property was big enough to hunt on , and the proximity of wooded cover surrounding it . I have an LL , so the tag would be meaningless to me , but other landowners who hunt might take offense .
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Post by drs on Aug 19, 2005 10:05:00 GMT -5
I've gotten the wrong info in the past from "asking the nice lady who answered the phone" , I stick with what a CO or Law Enforcement Division tells me . Hmmm ... Charging landowners to hunt on their own property ... I don't see that going over well even if it's a token amount . In fact , it could affect access for everyone else or cause the landowner to reconsider leasing . One of the biggest reasons I chose the home I currently live in was the fact that the property was big enough to hunt on , and the proximity of wooded cover surrounding it . I have an LL , so the tag would be meaningless to me , but other landowners who hunt might take offense . Kevin, You're most likely right about the "Nice" Lady answering the phone. It may or may not be correct, but so far she was correct. As for the "Token" License/Tags I have to agree with you as I too don't think it would be warmly received by TAX PAYING Landowners. I too have enough property behind my home inwhich to hunt Deer, Squirrels, Rabbits, and here in Vanderburgh County our Property Taxes are very high!!! What ever it is I'd wish the IDNR would leavethings alone!!!! "If it ain't broke don't fix it"!!!!!
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Post by cday on Aug 19, 2005 16:57:47 GMT -5
Why not most of the southern states land owners still have to purchase hunting licenses. This might be why they are so much cheaper down this way. The only exemption landowners have is fishing there private ponds with out a fishing license.
The point is every resident of each state owns the same amount of the wildlife with in the state. So if I do not own land and have to purchase a hunting licenase to take any of that wildlife so should everyone else. The land owner only owns the land not the wildlife which is upon it. The concept of a landowner not needing a license to hunt wildlife is really no diferent than them not having to obey seasons and bag limits in a sense.
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Post by gundude on Aug 19, 2005 17:36:00 GMT -5
I do it all the time and had a CO tell me it was OK.... He asked if I cut wood or had a garden. I said yes. He said great, SELL a bag of tomatos for $1.00 and you are covered.......... SO thats what I have done and no problems so far.....
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