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Post by featherduster on Oct 9, 2013 9:49:18 GMT -5
Fishing as a Felony
Teen Faces Prison Time for Leaving Fishing Equipment in High School Parking Lot
By Evan Bernick
The “zero tolerance” idiot parade marches on, leaving innocent people in its wake. This time, it’s a teenage fisherman, and he’s facing felony charges.
We’ve written recently [2] about children who’ve been suspended because of their schools’ zero tolerance policies concerning weapons. Yesterday, that idiocy reached new heights as 17-year-old Cody Chitwood, a student at Lassiter High School in Cobb County, Georgia, was charged [3] with a felony for bringing weapons into a school zone.
The weapons? Fishing knives. They were in his truck. In a tackle box.
Georgia law states that any knife “having a blade of two or more inches” is a weapon, and that anyone who carries a weapon onto school property by that very act is guilty of a crime.
This is an example of a “strict liability” crime—one that does not require that an offender have a culpable mental state in order to be found guilty. Laws of this kind, which are distressingly common nowadays, break with the traditional understanding of criminal law as reserved for those who have done something, well, wrong and deserve punishment.
If the district attorney decides to prosecute, Cody could face a minimum of two years in prison and up to 10 years in prison and a $10,000 fine. Besides the deprivation of freedom he’d suffer, a felony conviction would be more than enough to compromise his academic career and future job prospects. Cody knows it and has said that he is hoping to get the felony charge dropped so that he can still fulfill his dream of serving in the Air Force.
Thankfully, local legislators have identified the problem. “The public expects the same good common sense they use every day of their lives to apply to the laws of our state, and we as legislators seek nothing less,” said state Representative Ed Setzler (R) in a statement. “We’ll inspect the current state of the law, but our school leaders don’t like it, our law enforcement doesn’t like it, and we’re finding out the citizens who understand the current state of the law certainly don’t like it.” Laws that are thus at odds with the common sense of the community and contain such draconian penalties have no place in any statute book in this country.
It’s no consolation to the victims of absurd laws that those who draft them and enforce them mean well. Cody should not be prosecuted, but the very possibility that he could be charged should serve as an occasion for legal reform. Here’s hoping that Setzler and responsible local officials act quickly before another innocent kid finds himself facing hard time.
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Post by raporter on Oct 9, 2013 10:01:15 GMT -5
It just keep getting worse.
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Post by Genesis 27:3 on Oct 9, 2013 10:50:04 GMT -5
How absurd!
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Post by tenring on Oct 9, 2013 18:20:21 GMT -5
And just how did the Nazi's find them in a tackle box locked inside of his truck?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2013 18:28:44 GMT -5
It does sound absurd...BUT...
People need to know the law. We always jump on guys who don't follow game laws.
The zero tolerance policies in schools can get to be a bit much, admittedly, but what the articles don't usually say is the every one of those kids AND their parent or guardian, had to sign a paper at the beginning of the year that said they had read and are familiar with the policies and agree to abide by them.
There are two sides to the stupidity...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2013 18:34:18 GMT -5
I have to be REAL careful about leaving hunting stuff in my truck at work (school). I could very easily lose my job if I forgot and left a shotgun or bow in my truck. It's stupid, I know...but that's how it is and I have to be responsible for making sure I am in compliance with policy. It's the world we live in.
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Post by Genesis 27:3 on Oct 9, 2013 18:37:29 GMT -5
I agree with you Met, but I guess when I was that age I didn't consider my fillet knife a weapon as much as I did a tool. I know ignorance is no excuse for the law but I would hope that this young man would be given some leniency (based on his school record anyhow) and maybe not throw the book at him.
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Post by greghopper on Oct 9, 2013 18:41:06 GMT -5
And just how did the Nazi's find them in a tackle box locked inside of his truck? EXACTLY..... |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2013 18:46:34 GMT -5
I agree with you Met, but I guess when I was that age I didn't consider my fillet knife a weapon as much as I did a tool. I know ignorance is no excuse for the law but I would hope that this young man would be given some leniency (based on his school record anyhow) and maybe not throw the book at him. I totally agree! These kinds of laws and school policies need to be reexamined, that's for sure! |
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Post by GS1 on Oct 9, 2013 19:08:23 GMT -5
And just how did the Nazi's find them in a tackle box locked inside of his truck? They were doing a random sweep in the parking lot and the K-9 signaled on the boys vehicle. The dog detected the powder in a firecracker that was in the car and a search of the vehicle is how they found the knife. |
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Post by firstwd on Oct 9, 2013 19:49:15 GMT -5
And yet schools have ball bats, tennis racquets, forks, drills, hammers.......
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Post by ms660 on Oct 9, 2013 23:54:04 GMT -5
And to think, back when I was in high school I usually had a shotgun or a bow when hunting season was in hanging in the window on a gun rack in my truck parked in the school parking lot with the doors unlocked. That was almost 30 years ago and nobody thought a thing about it. I also always carried a pocket knife with a blade longer than 2". Heck we traded knives all the time at school and some of the men teachers got in on it. Times have changed and not for the best.
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Post by swilk on Oct 10, 2013 8:47:54 GMT -5
Met - what are your thoughts on the school that extended its policy onto the private property of a student?
I am talking about the student that was suspended/expelled for playing with a toy gun in his own yard.
The cases of zero tolerance I have a very hard time with are when they are subject to the opinion of an administrator or teacher .... when a kid bites his pastry into a shape someone else thinks kinda resembles a gun. Or when a kid playing an imaginary game pulls the pin on an imaginary grenade and imagines himself throwing it. Those cases are much different than when a kid really has a gun/knife even if the circumstances of having such things are innocent in nature.
If ever put into a similar position (as a parent) I will expend every resource at my disposal to right what I perceive to be wrong.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2013 9:18:26 GMT -5
I am not sure about the specific situation you mention about the kid in his own yard...that sounds fishy.
But the SCOTUS has ruled that kids don't have the same "personal privacy" rights on school property (including busses) as they do at home. Schools can and do perform random searches, K-9 sweeps, and so on, routinely.
As I said, it is all spelled out in the student handbook that must be read and signed by students and parents at the beginning of the year.
I liken it to my distaste for the orange on the ground blind law. I think it is a lame law, but I do know the law and if I am caught breaking it, I understand I will be cited.
There are a lot of policies in schools that go too far in the name of public safety...just as there are a lot of laws in the DNR that go too far in the name of public safety.
Would I turn a kid in for holding a poptart shaped like a gun? Of course not...BUT...I would warn him that it is against school policy and that someone might well turn him in.
Bringing a bag of oregano and joking with someone that it is pot is just as illegal as bringing pot. Stupid rule? Yes. Rule that kids are aware of and parents signed off on? Yes.
Make sense?
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Post by swilk on Oct 10, 2013 9:30:14 GMT -5
www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/24/7th-grader-suspended-for-playing-with-airsoft-gun-in-own-yard/Like all stories I am sure there is much more than we see printed here .... but if taken at face value I think they went way, way overboard. Are you saying that pastry that resembles a gun .... or any object that resembles a weapon of any type ... is expressly prohibited in your schools handbook? The conversation I would have with them would go something like this ... you do know that weapons come in all shapes and sizes dont you? Assuming you accept that then you must also accept that any object could be perceived as resembling a weapon depending on the person doing the observation. Therefore it all comes down to a subjective opinion of a person and not necessarily a black and white rule ..... and as such we have 2 choices. Court or common sense. Your call. You will be the one defending your decisions in the public eye. Not me.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2013 9:45:06 GMT -5
Actually, my school does not define weapon in the handbook. The poptart thing would not happen here.
However, these are some things that come straight from our handbook...
"POSSESSION= Students are required to inspect their possessions for the presense of unauthorized/illegal items before coming on school property. Students are "in possession" of an item when the item is on their person, in their immediate possession such as in their hand, pocket, purse, or backpack, is in a place excluseively under their control, or the student is aware the item is in a place to which the student has access such as a shared locker. More than one person may have "constructive possession" of a single item and be responsible for possession of the item."
"Drugs/Alcohol/Tobacco: Consuming, possessing, selling, offering....Any substance represented to be or thought to be, by the intended recipient, to be an illegal or prescription drug."
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Post by swilk on Oct 10, 2013 9:51:10 GMT -5
Thoughts on the toy gun in the yard?
Bat sh*t crazy is the only acceptable answer ... assuming the story is accurate.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2013 10:08:49 GMT -5
If that's the whole story, it's insane. I can't even imagine that it's the whole story though.
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Post by pigeonflier on Oct 10, 2013 13:13:30 GMT -5
I graduated from a small high school outside South Bend,, from La Ville Jr-Sr high school which was near Lakeville, In. I was in the class of 91. I can remember plenty of days leaving the woods and going straight to school with my gun or bow in the car. Heck I can remember showing my shop teacher my bow one day while we were in class. Never once did I ever give it a second thought? It was just part of the way of life. And I really don't think of 91 as being all that long ago. Can you imagine if my kid did that now? My goodness it would be like a nuclear war had started or close to it. I would say times are changing,, but like I said,, I don't think of 91 as all that long ago?
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Post by Woody Williams on Oct 10, 2013 14:30:00 GMT -5
Back in the 50s high schools had competing .22 rifle teams. It was nothing to see a kid carrying a rifle in school..
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