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Post by mrfixit on Mar 11, 2011 17:37:00 GMT -5
..... Why would anyone care what weapon I use as long as it is in a responsible manner? To me that says it all. Who cares who uses what as long as it's within the regs {to keep a level playing field for all hunters}. We have to be really careful and walk a fine line. If we aren't then all the division will only serve to hurt us all in the end. One only needs to look back at the first set of proposals to see what happens when one group of hunters attempts to gain an advantage for themselves or tries to promote their particular brand of hunting over others.
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Post by batchief909 on Mar 11, 2011 17:39:22 GMT -5
Sounds like a great question to me. One I need to really think about with all the changes that have come up in the last year or so. Where did gundude post this. I must have missed that thread.
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Post by hoosier on Mar 12, 2011 18:51:50 GMT -5
Give me a flintlock or recurve, wool, and maybe a treetop to hide in and I will eat a LOT of venison and have some FINE sets of antlers to admire.
Been doing it for years and recommend it highly. Satisfaction guaranteed! ;D
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Post by batchief909 on Mar 12, 2011 19:21:08 GMT -5
Yeah. Me too!
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Post by oneshot on Mar 13, 2011 8:19:03 GMT -5
What....what? ? I love my "Deer view mirror", and my "butt out tool", and my camoflague gum, and my..............you get the idea. On another note on the advancements.....we don't have to buy that stuff. Although it seeems like a lot of people do. But hey, thats the American way. If I want to invent something and market it for sale thats my right. And of course its anybodys right "not to buy it".
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Post by duff on Mar 13, 2011 10:00:57 GMT -5
I guess that is my problem with the question. It is aimed at trying to define what limits the regulators need to place on advancements/gimicks/technology/weapons/seasons based on hunter's opinions...enough is enough, let the freaking trained biologist set rules and limits based on the health of the herd and not what any group or legislators say. But the problem lies the DNR is not only in the biz of animal managment but also customer satisfaction. Hunters are the tools of the DNR mgmt needs to decide what changes and improvements are required to make their tools the more effective. If that is introducing a new weapon or molding the seasons so be it. At the same time they have to keep in mind their most effective tool (hunters) have opinions and might just hunt for a completely different reason than herd control.
Are the guys that are afraid of certain weapons or DNR trying to adjust their tools willing to let the DNR find a new tool? It isn't just about cross bows, rifles and dep. tags. It's about forcing the state to take a whole new stride in a different direction. Much like coyote control out west where the gov't employs trappers that will trap, shoot, poison and even explode coyotes in sheep country. That looks right past these gimicks and hunting tools and gets right to the heart of what might be the next big change in deer management. So keep fighting the war against hunters
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Post by steve46511 on Mar 15, 2011 7:16:29 GMT -5
My nephew (and some others) think the two bows I just bought made in the mid 50s wont "work" ......no place to attach anything and I don't know how "fast" they are.
Dang dumb ol' Uncle Steve,.......poor guy.
Must be losing it finally.......or is that again? lol
I run the gauntlet looking at new, improved, faster, better, "easier"........then I go back to same ol, same ol.......or something older and simpler.
Willing to wager that each generation has those, like me, that look at the new and improved with a less than favorable attitude. Human nature.
Tough to say what is "right and wrong" since, to my knowledge, the number of hunters AND number of deer have never reached this level previously so it's virgin territory.
The more people there are involved in anything........the less likely they will agree on anything.
That has seemed prettey constant in my more than half a century.
I don't have an answer but , for me, I'm staying with fun and simple after jumping the fence out of that corral once or twice myself.
God Bless
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Post by solohunter on Mar 20, 2011 21:34:28 GMT -5
I have posted about this before, years back there was a great article in Bowhunter mag or D&DH about all the gadgets. In reality it does not matter what or much you are toting, it is man vs deer. I cannot do the article justice but it really hit home for me, especially when I started an inventory of all the "crap" I carry. Carry a ruck sack or a pocket full, does not change your status as a hunter, and NOTHING material can alter the connection of man and deer. Solohunter
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Post by parson on Mar 21, 2011 6:02:19 GMT -5
Anybody can sneak up on a deer when they're relatively nekkid! (hunter, not deer). It takes some real skills to put the stalk on 'em while totin' all the latest gear from the Cabela's catalog!
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 21, 2011 7:17:37 GMT -5
I have posted about this before, years back there was a great article in Bowhunter mag or D&DH about all the gadgets. In reality it does not matter what or much you are toting, it is man vs deer. I cannot do the article justice but it really hit home for me, especially when I started an inventory of all the "crap" I carry. Carry a ruck sack or a pocket full, does not change your status as a hunter, and NOTHING material can alter the connection of man and deer. Solohunter Well said..
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Post by Russ Koon on Mar 21, 2011 9:05:51 GMT -5
Two points come to mind....
First, I agree that the newest and latest gadgets and go-fast gear are a factor in our success rate, but less of a factor than the advertisers would have us believe.
And secondly, there's a flaw in the logic that says we can tell that the gear improvements have had virtually no effect, because we still have more deer each year. That would seem logical, until you understand that our herd estimate is based primarily on the last year's kill numbers, so any improvement in our success ratio is seen as a sign that we have more deer. It's circular reasoning....we have more deer because we killed more, so we should adjust the reg's and allow more effective weapons and gear so we can kill more. Which will result in our killing more, and that will be interpreted as herd growth, etc., etc.
If we were basing herd number estimates less on kill numbers, we would get a much more accurate picture, IMO. The current system has been in place for a long time. I saw a LOT more deer in the early 90's than I do now. Didn't you?
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Post by firstwd on Mar 21, 2011 10:38:16 GMT -5
Anybody can sneak up on a deer when they're relatively nekkid! (hunter, not deer). It takes some real skills to put the stalk on 'em while totin' all the latest gear from the Cabela's catalog! How true it is.....
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Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2011 14:35:33 GMT -5
Anybody can sneak up on a deer when they're relatively nekkid! (hunter, not deer). It takes some real skills to put the stalk on 'em while totin' all the latest gear from the Cabela's catalog! How true it is..... Depends greatly on the number of nearby green briar bushes
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 21, 2011 14:54:48 GMT -5
Depends greatly on the number of nearby green briar bushes A friend of mine in Texas named Bob Sikes , but we call him "Goatskin" is a hunter's hunter. It doesn't matter what hunting tool you place in his hands he will kill something. He does it all on the ground. He mostly wears shorts while hunting, unless it is cold. He said that he moves to fast if he wears long pants. The shorts in the Texas brush tells him to slow down. I gave him one of my old compounds as he said he would like to get into bowhunting. He learned shooting on his own. He tried bare fingers, but that was tough even on an old cowboy's fingers. I told him to get a finger tab. he said none fitted his style of shootIng - two fingers over and one under. That was what he was most comfortable at. I told him to get a left handed one and shoot it upside down. That worked. First time out he killed a nice buck. To kill it he had to lay on his back and shoot under some scrub. Something that probably no bowhunter would think of doing. Like I said, when he goes hunting something is going to die I noticed a lot of African guides wear shorts too.
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Post by parson on Mar 21, 2011 15:43:38 GMT -5
Huntin' in shorts in Texas has to be like fryin' bacon in the all-together!
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Post by mattfinney on Mar 25, 2011 15:03:57 GMT -5
Swilk and Russ Koon nailed it on this thread.
What kills me the most is when guys decide whether something is right or wrong based on legality. You'll often hear these folks say things like "I don't care what others do....as long as it's legal."
My response is.....What??
If hunting was illegal, would that mean that it is wrong to hunt?
If hunting deer with bait, dogs, snares, and spotlights were legal, would that make it right?
Look, we (society) decide (arbitrarily) what is right and wrong, then design laws accordingly. To look to our laws to decide whether something is right or wrong is complete rubbish....IMO.
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Post by throbak on Mar 25, 2011 15:17:32 GMT -5
what ever makes your boat float Matt I think the laws should be the first place to look
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Post by mattfinney on Mar 25, 2011 15:26:00 GMT -5
I'm just saying that our (actually all) laws are arbitrary....rightness and wrongness shouldn't be.
If you look to the laws to decide rightness and wrongness, you're putting the cart before the horse IMO.
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Post by firstwd on Mar 25, 2011 16:21:07 GMT -5
Depends greatly on the number of nearby green briar bushes Now that just brought back a few repressed memories.....
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Post by firstwd on Mar 25, 2011 16:30:30 GMT -5
I'm just saying that our (actually all) laws are arbitrary....rightness and wrongness shouldn't be. If you look to the laws to decide rightness and wrongness, you're putting the cart before the horse IMO. Since we have progressed well beyond the days of the Native Americans, where mutual respect of others and nature itself and violently defending ones territory kept other from encroaching on what one "rightfully" does, the laws and punishments of the society we've built have to be the first place to look as a general rule. If your morality makes you feel your actions are not "right" then your morality will take residence, but you can not force that upon others.
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