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Post by esshup on Jan 12, 2022 11:45:06 GMT -5
Tankless water heater also requires significant electric, so check all that stuff out. If you only have 100 amp service, could be getting questionable. Ours just sits on the deck. Added a little extra support framing beforehand and haven't had an issue. That only is if the tankless is an electric model, I have one that is natural gas and love it. I saw an immediate drop in the gas bill when it was installed. I like the unlimited hot water, especially if washing something with hot water outside in the winter.
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Hot tub?
Jan 12, 2022 12:58:28 GMT -5
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Post by scrub-buster on Jan 12, 2022 12:58:28 GMT -5
Tankless water heater also requires significant electric, so check all that stuff out. If you only have 100 amp service, could be getting questionable. Ours just sits on the deck. Added a little extra support framing beforehand and haven't had an issue. How do I tell what service I have in the house?
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Post by jjas on Jan 12, 2022 13:23:24 GMT -5
Tankless water heater also requires significant electric, so check all that stuff out. If you only have 100 amp service, could be getting questionable. Ours just sits on the deck. Added a little extra support framing beforehand and haven't had an issue. How do I tell what service I have in the house? Check the main breaker in your circuit breaker box and see how many amps it's rated for.
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Post by sculver7 on Jan 12, 2022 15:58:27 GMT -5
How do I tell what service I have in the house? Check the main breaker in your circuit breaker box and see how many amps it's rated for. This^^ Also, if you have smaller than a 200 amp service, I would be extremely hesitant to install the hot tub with the existing service. It would probably work on a 100 amp service but you're running a risk of low voltage when you have other things running in your house at the same time as the hot tub. It's all about your maximum load that would realistically be running at the same time. If you have a 200 amp service or bigger, you should be fine as long as you don't have a bunch of other items (such as steam showers, geothermal heat pumps, etc.) running at the same time as the hot tub. Even then, it might work, but you'd be pushing it. Those items create a large electrical draw.
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Hot tub?
Jan 12, 2022 16:29:30 GMT -5
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Post by greghopper on Jan 12, 2022 16:29:30 GMT -5
Personally I get the Hot tub that run off 110 and require a 30 amp breaker!
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Post by beermaker on Jan 12, 2022 19:21:30 GMT -5
Tankless water heater also requires significant electric, so check all that stuff out. If you only have 100 amp service, could be getting questionable. Ours just sits on the deck. Added a little extra support framing beforehand and haven't had an issue. That only is if the tankless is an electric model, I have one that is natural gas and love it. I saw an immediate drop in the gas bill when it was installed. I like the unlimited hot water, especially if washing something with hot water outside in the winter. Well said. After having a gas powered tankless heater for three years, I could not imagine paying money for anything else. It's a hit to the wallet up front, but the efficiency and convenience pay off over time.
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Hot tub?
Jan 12, 2022 20:58:38 GMT -5
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Post by scrub-buster on Jan 12, 2022 20:58:38 GMT -5
I just checked. I have a 200 amp breaker. The tankless water heater I want to get will be electric. I don't have gas.
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Post by esshup on Jan 13, 2022 8:05:44 GMT -5
I just checked. I have a 200 amp breaker. The tankless water heater I want to get will be electric. I don't have gas. The thing about the tankless is that you aren't using energy to keep water hot in the tank when you aren't using it. The flip side of the coin is that if you wanted to trickle warm/hot water on something to defrost it in the kitchen sink, you might not be able to because they need "X" Gallons per minute flowing through them to turn on. The one that I had 15 years ago IIRC turned on at .75 gpm which was too much of a flow to trickle heated water. The new one I have now needs 1/2 gpm to turn on. When we had that very cold snap 3 or 4 years ago with the wind, mine froze and split the heat exchanger. I took that to a radiator repair shop but then the circuit board was bad from the water. It was 50% of a new one just for the board to get it fixed, and when I called Bosch they said that because I was an existing customer that a new one would only be 75% of a new one so I just replaced it.
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Hot tub?
Jan 13, 2022 8:34:32 GMT -5
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Post by scrub-buster on Jan 13, 2022 8:34:32 GMT -5
I just checked. I have a 200 amp breaker. The tankless water heater I want to get will be electric. I don't have gas. The thing about the tankless is that you aren't using energy to keep water hot in the tank when you aren't using it. The flip side of the coin is that if you wanted to trickle warm/hot water on something to defrost it in the kitchen sink, you might not be able to because they need "X" Gallons per minute flowing through them to turn on. The one that I had 15 years ago IIRC turned on at .75 gpm which was too much of a flow to trickle heated water. The new one I have now needs 1/2 gpm to turn on. When we had that very cold snap 3 or 4 years ago with the wind, mine froze and split the heat exchanger. I took that to a radiator repair shop but then the circuit board was bad from the water. It was 50% of a new one just for the board to get it fixed, and when I called Bosch they said that because I was an existing customer that a new one would only be 75% of a new one so I just replaced it. I've never had to leave the water on to prevent frozen pipes and I've lived here 12 years. I just hate the idea of heating water 24 hours a day when we only use hot water in a 2 hour span in the evenings.
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Post by esshup on Jan 13, 2022 8:43:56 GMT -5
Then a tankless would save you $$$..
I meant trickle warm water onto something in the kitchen sink to defrost it (instead of using cold water).
It was the perfect set of wind conditions that made my tankless freeze. We had -15°F temps, the wind was howling out of the SSW and the damper in the exhaust vent in the tankless heater didn't close all the way, so the cold wind was blowing backwards through the system. That's what froze it. If I would have used hot water a few times during the cold snap I doubt it would have froze.
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Post by chewbacca on Jan 13, 2022 9:10:22 GMT -5
The thing about the tankless is that you aren't using energy to keep water hot in the tank when you aren't using it. The flip side of the coin is that if you wanted to trickle warm/hot water on something to defrost it in the kitchen sink, you might not be able to because they need "X" Gallons per minute flowing through them to turn on. The one that I had 15 years ago IIRC turned on at .75 gpm which was too much of a flow to trickle heated water. The new one I have now needs 1/2 gpm to turn on. When we had that very cold snap 3 or 4 years ago with the wind, mine froze and split the heat exchanger. I took that to a radiator repair shop but then the circuit board was bad from the water. It was 50% of a new one just for the board to get it fixed, and when I called Bosch they said that because I was an existing customer that a new one would only be 75% of a new one so I just replaced it. I've never had to leave the water on to prevent frozen pipes and I've lived here 12 years. I just hate the idea of heating water 24 hours a day when we only use hot water in a 2 hour span in the evenings. A simple, inexpensive fix would be to run your existing tank type water heater through a water heater timer. For a little more money they have them in wifi which can be controlled from your smartphone. The downfall to a tankless system is water pressure can suffer if too many fixtures are running at the same time. As a plumbing inspector I come across tankless heater installs pretty regularly. The biggest complaint many people have is that 2 people can't shower at the same time (in separate showers of course) without a reduction in either pressure, temperature or both. For a family with more than 5 people a second water heater is almost a necessity. Also, you mentioned installing a water softener, if you are going to go tankless you will definitely want to add a softener. If not the lime scale will end up clogging your system and it will be an expensive repair or replacement. Just some stuff to keep in mind if you are considering tankless.
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Hot tub?
Jan 13, 2022 9:15:36 GMT -5
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Post by scrub-buster on Jan 13, 2022 9:15:36 GMT -5
I've never had to leave the water on to prevent frozen pipes and I've lived here 12 years. I just hate the idea of heating water 24 hours a day when we only use hot water in a 2 hour span in the evenings. A simple, inexpensive fix would be to run your existing tank type water heater through a water heater timer. For a little more money they have them in wifi which can be controlled from your smartphone. The downfall to a tankless system is water pressure can suffer if too many fixtures are running at the same time. As a plumbing inspector I come across tankless heater installs pretty regularly. The biggest complaint many people have is that 2 people can't shower at the same time (in separate showers of course) without a reduction in either pressure, temperature or both. For a family with more than 5 people a second water heater is almost a necessity. Also, you mentioned installing a water softener, if you are going to go tankless you will definitely want to add a softener. If not the lime scale will end up clogging your system and it will be an expensive repair or replacement. Just some stuff to keep in mind if you are considering tankless. We have very hard water. My tank water heater is 12 years old and I fight it leaking every year when I clean it out. A softener is definitely going to happen when I go tankless. We only use 1 shower at a time so that isn't a problem. I need to remove the tank heater to make room for the softener. I want a very small utility sink next to it that is fed from the hard water. I need a place to fill up my water filter pitcher. I don't like the taste of softened water.
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Post by steiny on Jan 13, 2022 10:10:11 GMT -5
Installed many of those tankless water heaters in our business and found that they cost more and do not have near as long life as a standard tank type water heater. Wasn't unusual for a tankless to poop out in 5-7 years.
Only reason I would install tankless, is if I did not have space for a tank type.
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Post by freedomhunter on Jan 13, 2022 16:20:54 GMT -5
Good advice from chewbacca. I wouldn't trade my set up for hard well water. A good quality softener and also potassium permanganate treatment and a tank water heater with the mag rod removed. You can fill up pitchers in the fridge and it is as good as bottled water.
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Post by treetop on Jan 13, 2022 19:18:49 GMT -5
Installed many of those tankless water heaters in our business and found that they cost more and do not have near as long life as a standard tank type water heater. Wasn't unusual for a tankless to poop out in 5-7 years. Only reason I would install tankless, is if I did not have space for a tank type. 100 percent agree Tankless water heaters do save money on gas electric But we have found Cost to buy and install can be 2 to 3 times the amount for a family of 4 or 5 you can overcome that cost with savings 2 people not going to happen you normally can’t save enough If your water is not good they won’t last Unless you have good water pressure you won’t be happy A break down normally is going to be a higher cost to fix a lot of the times I could buy a standered water heater for the same money I’m not talking DIY repair but a service call I personally would not buy one for these reasons if you have the room it’s hard to beat a power vent 40 gallon gas tank on natural gas LP over electric depends on cost of LP vrs KW cost and water usage
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Hot tub?
Jan 14, 2022 12:51:59 GMT -5
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Post by scrub-buster on Jan 14, 2022 12:51:59 GMT -5
Installed many of those tankless water heaters in our business and found that they cost more and do not have near as long life as a standard tank type water heater. Wasn't unusual for a tankless to poop out in 5-7 years. Only reason I would install tankless, is if I did not have space for a tank type. 100 percent agree Tankless water heaters do save money on gas electric But we have found Cost to buy and install can be 2 to 3 times the amount for a family of 4 or 5 you can overcome that cost with savings 2 people not going to happen you normally can’t save enough If your water is not good they won’t last Unless you have good water pressure you won’t be happy A break down normally is going to be a higher cost to fix a lot of the times I could buy a standered water heater for the same money I’m not talking DIY repair but a service call I personally would not buy one for these reasons if you have the room it’s hard to beat a power vent 40 gallon gas tank on natural gas LP over electric depends on cost of LP vrs KW cost and water usage So would you recommend I stay with a tank water heater? All my appliances are electric. I don't have gas. It's just 2 people living here except every other weekend than there are 2 teenagers staying with us. We have hard water. I definitely want to to install a water softener no matter what way I go with the heater.
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Post by freedomhunter on Jan 14, 2022 15:47:08 GMT -5
don't know much about tankless, but it would seem to me you would miss the settling qualities of a tank that would help with any suspended particulates that make it past your well screen and softener (like during really wet ground conditions). I would guess all that would hit the tankless heater directly and muck it up.
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Hot tub?
Jan 14, 2022 21:56:21 GMT -5
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Post by scrub-buster on Jan 14, 2022 21:56:21 GMT -5
don't know much about tankless, but it would seem to me you would miss the settling qualities of a tank that would help with any suspended particulates that make it past your well screen and softener (like during really wet ground conditions). I would guess all that would hit the tankless heater directly and muck it up. I don't have well water. I have city water.
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Post by steiny on Jan 17, 2022 16:11:30 GMT -5
I'd save yourself some money and stick with a tank type water heater.
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Hot tub?
Jan 17, 2022 18:27:32 GMT -5
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Post by scrub-buster on Jan 17, 2022 18:27:32 GMT -5
I'd save yourself some money and stick with a tank type water heater. I think that's what I'll probably do
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