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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 21, 2019 17:36:40 GMT -5
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Post by mgderf on Mar 21, 2019 21:42:04 GMT -5
I guess that's one point of view. Mine is to kill coyotes on sight.
Even if they don't affect the deer population on a whole, they do have an effect on where the deer population travel, or don't travel. It's been my experience that deer are not necessarily comfortable with coyote around.
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Post by Russ Koon on Mar 21, 2019 22:52:14 GMT -5
First impression is his conclusion was drawn on the basis of population figures which are known to have been sketchy at best for deer, and on the number of coyotes sold at fur buyers. Then those two scientifically shaky figures are compared as though there no other factors that could have been responsible for the apparent interactions.
Fur prices would seem tome to be a likely factor in coyote furs sold, and the numbers of coyotes taken by hunters who don't care about taking them to a fur buyer and just want them to disappear from their favorite areas would need to be accounted for to be closer to some sort of worthwhile conclusion. So would a yearly estimation of the percentage of deer that were taken or killed without showing up in the statistics.
Kinda reminded me of the days a generation or so ago when a renowned "expert" had articles in the magazines and seminars at the sports shows explaining how the coyotes were our friends and lived mainly on mice and roadkill. His name escapes me at the moment, but you may remember him.
I'd put more faith in the fact that a fawn in distress call is a very successful sound to use when calling coyotes, as is a hen turkey yelp. And mother nature, over time, has set the coyote's biological clock to have pups at a time when there are lots of new fawns to feed them. Few such relationships in nature exist by lucky accident.
I know I've watched two coyotes taking turns chasing an adult doe around a pasture a few laps, until she escaped that game by jumping the fence and taking a different route through the woods. I suppose they could have been just playing a friendly game, but I doubt it.
I did an unofficial and unscientific study of coyote droppings for a couple years when I hunted down in the Hoosier National and hiked in a mile or so before leaving the two-track on the main ridge. Coyotes tend to leave their calling card as a territorial claim on roads and trails, so I made it a point to inspect the droppings for recognizable contents. Didn't carry them out to use a microscope, just used a stick. Found a lot of persimmon seeds, which kinda surprised me, but found fur in every one of them. Looked like gray squirrel in most cases. Most of it looked too long for mouse fur and not brown enough. Wonder if anyone has conducted scientific analysis of coyote poop collected in May.
They are omnivorous, but predominantly carnivorous.
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Post by steiny on Mar 22, 2019 8:55:44 GMT -5
Totally unscientific observations, but there is something about deer and coyotes that work together, because years ago in my part of Indiana we had few if any deer or coyotes, the population of both has expanded kind of hand in hand. We now have lots of deer and lots of coyotes. I've also concluded from hunting many other states that the best deer hunting places also have a bunch of coyotes.
Maybe the constant pressure from coyotes weeds out the dumb deer, keeps them on their toes and makes for a stronger more alert and healthy deer herd?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2019 9:06:50 GMT -5
I have read I think from Deer & Deer that coyotes populations follow deer populations. So yes, hand and hand. It will be interesting what the bobcat population does to both coyotes and deer.
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Post by esshup on Mar 22, 2019 14:12:51 GMT -5
I was the first one to post a comment there in the form of a few questions. It will be interesting to see if he comes back there to answer those questions.
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Post by moose1am on Mar 26, 2019 15:09:51 GMT -5
I guess that's one point of view. Mine is to kill coyotes on sight. Even if they don't affect the deer population on a whole, they do have an effect on where the deer population travel, or don't travel. It's been my experience that deer are not necessarily comfortable with coyote around. Coyotes eat more than deer. They will take quail, Turkey, rabbits, squirrels and anything else they can get their mouths on. And I think that they have a bigger effect on fawns that the guy in the video thinks. I do think that human's have a greater effect on deer populations than other predators. We kill a lot of older deer and not just the young. Coyotes take down the fawns more than the adults. IMHO.
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Post by esshup on Mar 26, 2019 15:35:32 GMT -5
Didn't someone put a trail cam or other type of camera on a coyote den and the parents brought around 70 to 80 fawns to the pups before the pups left the den?
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Post by whitetaildave24 on Mar 26, 2019 17:32:36 GMT -5
Didn't someone put a trail cam or other type of camera on a coyote den and the parents brought around 70 to 80 fawns to the pups before the pups left the den? If that’s the case I have severely been underestimating their impact on fawns.
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Post by esshup on Mar 26, 2019 21:48:49 GMT -5
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