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Post by nfalls116 on May 25, 2016 18:37:10 GMT -5
I love cannons
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Post by greghopper on May 25, 2016 18:39:23 GMT -5
All depends on the objective .......
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Post by nfalls116 on May 25, 2016 18:51:41 GMT -5
All depends on the objective ....... valid point
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Post by airgun on May 25, 2016 20:18:05 GMT -5
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Post by ms660 on May 25, 2016 21:05:15 GMT -5
Looks like fun,but I hate to see it being done to one the most significant tools in the history of mankind.
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Post by airgun on May 25, 2016 21:19:57 GMT -5
Looks like fun,but I hate to see it being done to one the most significant tools in the history of mankind. What about all of that good black powder just going up in smoke?
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Post by ms660 on May 25, 2016 21:54:18 GMT -5
There was a time just leaning on a mans anvil could get your skull crushed. Out of all the tools I own and that's many, my two anvils will be with until the day I die. I seldom use them much anymore and I get tired walking around them but they ain't going no where. All other tools I have bought can be replaced, but not my anvils.
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Post by moose1am on May 25, 2016 23:47:09 GMT -5
You do not have to spend $ 1,900 on a air rifle there are cheaper ones out there. He was using a ("PCP" a air gun that has 3,000 - 4,000 psi tank). You can purchase a "springer" or a "gas piston" a lot cheaper just means you can not shoot as far. However the springer needs to be held gently (military hold). The "springer MUST be able to move forward and backward the same each time it's shot. Which also means you CAN NOT purchase a standard scope (they will destroy it) they need to manufactured for air guns. Todays air rifles can match or exceed a 22 caliber rim fire rifles and are a lot cheaper to shoot. A good springer can shoot 5 shots at ten yards that a dime can cover, and at fifty yards a quarter can cover all of the shots. I just read and figured out that shooting a Springer is different than a regular rifle. Holding it loosely so that it can do it's thing. I have a ERT type air rifle, Gamo. I'm still trying to learn how to shoot it accurately. Actually I have two of them. The Bone Collector and the other one who's name fails me now. Fusion Elite I believe. Both don't shoot accurately if you hold them too tightly against your shoulder.
I have a air pistol that's CO2 powered and the flat head pellets bounced off a squirrel at point blank range. Which surprised the heck out of me. I had the squirrel in a hav-a-heart cage and could not kill it until I shot it with one of the air rifles. The air pistol shoots at around 500 ft per second and the 4.5 grain pellets were not penetrating the squirrels hide/skin. But the Gamo Fusion Elite when right into it's back and killed it. It took more than one shot as the squirrel was facing away and hiding it's head for a while. Then it decided to attack the cage and try to get at me. That was his big mistake. Normally I take them to the Fish and Wildlife area and release them alive. But it was raining and I just put it out of it's misery. I had been trying to either shoot this squirrel or trap it for about two months. I was avoiding the trip mechanism inside the cage by running though the cage and hopping over the trip pan. Finally it stepped on the trip pan and got caught. He ate a lot of my sunflower seeds over the months.
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Post by moose1am on May 25, 2016 23:51:08 GMT -5
You have owned a air rifle less than 3 months and your now ready for Turkeys ??
Absolutely no apprenticeship needed! I have been shooting and hunting all of my life it's just another tool. So if you purchased a "new" car/truck are you ready to drive it home or do you practice first? Just saying!!
When I got my New Datsun 240z back in 1973 it took a while to get used to driving it. I went from driving a 1972 Datsun 720 pick up truck to the Z car and the long hood and low seats took me a while to feel comfortable with. Plus the acceleration was much different. The 720 Datsun maxed out at around 70 mph while the 240 Z maxed out at around 130 mph. The Z cars hood wanted to lift up off the road at 110 mph. The next years ,1974, Datsun added a spoiler under the nose of the car to keep it's nose down when it went fast. And that actually seems to help I'm told. I use to average about 90 mph driving from Evansville, IN down to Panama City Florida. That car was a dream to drive when I was still in my early 20's.
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Post by airgun on May 26, 2016 7:46:31 GMT -5
You do not have to spend $ 1,900 on a air rifle there are cheaper ones out there. He was using a ("PCP" a air gun that has 3,000 - 4,000 psi tank). You can purchase a "springer" or a "gas piston" a lot cheaper just means you can not shoot as far. However the springer needs to be held gently (military hold). The "springer MUST be able to move forward and backward the same each time it's shot. Which also means you CAN NOT purchase a standard scope (they will destroy it) they need to manufactured for air guns. Todays air rifles can match or exceed a 22 caliber rim fire rifles and are a lot cheaper to shoot. A good springer can shoot 5 shots at ten yards that a dime can cover, and at fifty yards a quarter can cover all of the shots. I just read and figured out that shooting a Springer is different than a regular rifle. Holding it loosely so that it can do it's thing. I have a ERT type air rifle, Gamo. I'm still trying to learn how to shoot it accurately. Actually I have two of them. The Bone Collector and the other one who's name fails me now. Fusion Elite I believe. Both don't shoot accurately if you hold them too tightly against your shoulder.
I have a air pistol that's CO2 powered and the flat head pellets bounced off a squirrel at point blank range. Which surprised the heck out of me. I had the squirrel in a hav-a-heart cage and could not kill it until I shot it with one of the air rifles. The air pistol shoots at around 500 ft per second and the 4.5 grain pellets were not penetrating the squirrels hide/skin. But the Gamo Fusion Elite when right into it's back and killed it. It took more than one shot as the squirrel was facing away and hiding it's head for a while. Then it decided to attack the cage and try to get at me. That was his big mistake. Normally I take them to the Fish and Wildlife area and release them alive. But it was raining and I just put it out of it's misery. I had been trying to either shoot this squirrel or trap it for about two months. I was avoiding the trip mechanism inside the cage by running though the cage and hopping over the trip pan. Finally it stepped on the trip pan and got caught. He ate a lot of my sunflower seeds over the months.
What pellets are you shooting? Each air rifle (even with the same maker, model #) can shoot differently with the same pellets. Most air rifle stores (air guns of Arizona, Pyramid air etc...) offer sample pellets packs. They give you several different brands, weights, diameters, etc... to shoot so you can find the best one for your air rifle. I know with my HW97K22 it took almost shooting 2500 pellets thru it before it broke in. I am shooting H&N Field Target Trophy 14.66 gr, 22 caliber. H&N is a higher end pellet that could be used in comp. shooting. There a ton of pellets on the market and that can be difficult to find the correct one. The downside is they must be ordered from air gun stores, my local stores do not carry them so I order them online. Even the big gun stores Bass pro, Gander mountain will only carry Crossman, Gamo brand.
I am guessing here but I would say the gun you were using that bounced a pellet is a low powered one. Mine has 13 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle and it will bury a pellet into a 4 X 4 at seventy yards. A lot of CO2, PCP air rifles can be metered down to low power to get more shots per fill up v/s more power.
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Post by moose1am on May 26, 2016 9:38:52 GMT -5
Yea the air pistol that I used was a low powered air gun. It was the CPSport from UmarexUSA. Maybe the CO2 had leaked out of it some. Some of the pellets may have been bouncing off the wire of the cage and the holes in the wire were only about 1" x 1". The wire on the cage was pretty heavy duty gage wire too.
And I have shot a lot of different types of pellets though the Gamo Bone Collector Inert Gas Technology Air Rifle over the past two or three years. The light weight allow pellets (Gamo Blue plastic tips and Red Plastic Tips) shoot differently. One is made out of lead and the other some type of light weight allow. The lighter weight pellets go really fast and break the sound barrier and are very loud.
I also shoot several varieties of the Crossman lead pellets. The ones with the flat nose seem to group best at 25 yards in my Gamo Bone Collector. The Gamo Whisper Fusion Elite shoots a little better as it's scope base is stronger and has 3 or 5 screws that hold the base on the rifle's upper receiver. So it's got a more solid connection to the top of the rifle than the Bone Collector does.
Different weights of pellets shoot differently though both my Inert Gas Technology Springers From Gamo.
I had a hard time with the Bone Collector's rifle scope staying on the receiver. It moved back with each shot and changed the sight picture after every shot. The scope was actually hanging off the back of the receiver and ready to fall off before I noticed that it was moving backwards. I added another scope stop behind the scope's rear ring and that stopped it from moving backwards. So now once I get it sighted back in it should hold a better POA and POI. Wind has a pronounced effect on the lighter weight and faster alloy pellets.
Some times I take the Air Rifles up to the shooting range where everyone else is shooting AR15 and 308 and get a lot of compliments on the looks of the Bone Collector Air Rifle and the Gamo Whisper Fusion Elite Air Rifle too.
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Post by bullseye69 on May 26, 2016 10:08:09 GMT -5
SMH what will they think of next?
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Post by airgun on May 26, 2016 10:14:53 GMT -5
I just changed my picture. If, you can see the picture one was shot at ten yards all five shots were in the 1/2" circle (they were actually under 3/8" edge to edge). The other was five shots at thirty yards all of them in the 1" circle (actually they were edge to edge .640"). A dime covered all of them so shot placement between 10 - 30 yards should not be a concern. Most turkeys are harvested in these ranges with shot guns and bows.
If I could post the pictures I would show the both pictures, one as shot, and the other with a dime covering them. All shots were taken while sitting in chair with a Primos trigger tripod just as I would use in hunting.
Check out a scope stop that will help you out. My scope mount has a stop built into it and my gun has holes in the top of the scope mount that the pin goes into so I do not have that issue. Faster pellet speed is not a good thing in some guns, they actually cause patterning problems. I personally like a slower pellet with a average knock down power. My rifles barrel is under 12" long yet I have precision shot placement. If you were to look up a HW97K22 you would see a air chamber on the end of the barrel making it soft sounding. I am getting 625 - 650 feet per second with a 13 foot pounds of engery at the muzzle. That's enough to cleanly put down a squirrel, rabbit, and of course a turkey.
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Post by beermaker on May 26, 2016 14:11:50 GMT -5
I have not gone back and read this entire thread. So, please forgive me if I get off track.
Yes, high quality air guns are expensive. But it is a hobby for many and, when compared to some other hobbies, its not that bad. I don't play golf anymore, never have gambled, take very few vacations, no addictions, live in a modest house, etc. I can afford my hobby and have no shame in doing so. Know anyone that drag races? Ask how much a set of tires and annual engine rebuild costs. I have a friend that takes cheap shots at me whenever he gets a chance. Yet he has a few horses that he does nothing but feed and spend money on. I could go on and on.
Yes, you can buy a $150 Gamo anywhere. The difference in that and a good gun is like using a $100 Rural King climber compared to a Summit. Yeah it will work and do the job, but there is definitely a difference.
Above all, I just enjoy the hell out of shooting mine. I get one-hole consistency at 30 yards, dime size at 75, and about two inch (better if no wind) at 100. I now look forward to squirrel hunting like never before. I once was able to bag the limit in a grove of hickory trees in less than an hour. The noise from cutting and dropping hulls was way louder than my gun. I easily could have taken more.
A Benjamin Marauder and pump can be purchased for around $550. Its probably the best value in guns, period. If you have the space to shoot, buy one and give it a try.
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Post by ms660 on May 26, 2016 15:42:52 GMT -5
I have not gone back and read this entire thread. So, please forgive me if I get off track. Yes, high quality air guns are expensive. But it is a hobby for many and, when compared to some other hobbies, its not that bad. I don't play golf anymore, never have gambled, take very few vacations, no addictions, live in a modest house, etc. I can afford my hobby and have no shame in doing so. Know anyone that drag races? Ask how much a set of tires and annual engine rebuild costs. I have a friend that takes cheap shots at me whenever he gets a chance. Yet he has a few horses that he does nothing but feed and spend money on. I could go on and on. Yes, you can buy a $150 Gamo anywhere. The difference in that and a good gun is like using a $100 Rural King climber compared to a Summit. Yeah it will work and do the job, but there is definitely a difference. Above all, I just enjoy the hell out of shooting mine. I get one-hole consistency at 30 yards, dime size at 75, and about two inch (better if no wind) at 100. I now look forward to squirrel hunting like never before. I once was able to bag the limit in a grove of hickory trees in less than an hour. The noise from cutting and dropping hulls was way louder than my gun. I easily could have taken more. A Benjamin Marauder and pump can be purchased for around $550. Its probably the best value in guns, period. If you have the space to shoot, buy one and give it a try. How many shots are you firing with groups like that? and what are you using getting groups like that? please don't tell me a Benjamin Marauder. The worlds best ISSF shooters shooting at 10 meters using $5000 plus guns are not consistently shooting one hole groups
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Post by airgun on May 26, 2016 16:01:18 GMT -5
beermaker, when I was doing my research on air guns, I thought about Benjamin Marauder. It took me almost six months of reading, YouTube videos to make my decision. The only reason why I did not get the Marauder is just thinking about 150 pumps (on a empty gun) and needing to wait when the pump was hot. Without having a air gun store near me or knowing someone that own one I passed one it. So do you carry the pump with you when you go hunting? I have seen PCP that has changeable tanks, which could be handy when hunting. I opted on a "springer" in a 22 caliber I can not shoot the 100 yard shots like you. But fourty yards and under it's on. The CPC are nice specially when you want to take multiple shots (faster).
Now that you have been shooting the Marauder for awhile do you think you could harvest a wild turkey cleanly?
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Post by beermaker on May 26, 2016 16:58:13 GMT -5
I do not have a Marauder, but have shot plenty of them. My friend uses one and typically takes 100+ squirrels yearly. He is a damn good hunter and only takes head shots. He credits a good portion of his success to the quietness of the Marauder.
If you want to get a taste of the PCP world, I suggest buying a Marauder and a used scuba tank. You can sometimes get a refurbished Marauder for $300+/-. A used scuba tank will cost around $100 and can be filled at a dive shop, paintball store, of at the local firehouse. You won't get as many fills as from a carbon fiber tank, but this is where most guys start.
I currently have a Kalibrgun Cricket .25 and an Edgun Matador R3M .22. They both get 60+ shots and are accurate beyond my abilities.
Yes, a .25 Marauder is more than capable of cleanly harvesting a turkey. Air guns are already legal for turkeys in many states. Personally, I would not use a .22, but a well placed head shot will still do it.
I typically measure consistency by five shot groups. I should have mentioned that I am talking about bench rest shooting. There are more air rifles out there capable of one hole groups at 30 yards than I can count.
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Post by airgun on May 26, 2016 20:22:07 GMT -5
beermaker, at this time I am not interested in a PCP, as a SCUBA diver I already have the tanks. At the local dive shop it cost $10.00 per fill and if I understand correctly it will fill a PCP about three times before the SCUBA tank has to,be refilled. I really thought hard about it and looked at all of the options including purchasing a $ 2,500.00 compressor to fill a carbon tank and decided to go to a "springer" I liked the challenge of the military hold and the general issues of shooting it. My springer is a 22 caliber and at seventy yards it will bury a pellet into a treated 4 X 4 that you will need a knife to dig it out. That's more than enough power to cleanly put a wild turkey in the freezer. Now I can cocking (reloading) it while squirrel hunting making it more difficult to keep from being noticed, this is where a PCP will be nice.
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Post by bullseye69 on May 26, 2016 22:01:01 GMT -5
beermaker, at this time I am not interested in a PCP, as a SCUBA diver I already have the tanks. At the local dive shop it cost $10.00 per fill and if I understand correctly it will fill a PCP about three times before the SCUBA tank has to,be refilled. I really thought hard about it and looked at all of the options including purchasing a $ 2,500.00 compressor to fill a carbon tank and decided to go to a "springer" I liked the challenge of the military hold and the general issues of shooting it. My springer is a 22 caliber and at seventy yards it will bury a pellet into a treated 4 X 4 that you will need a knife to dig it out. That's more than enough power to cleanly put a wild turkey in the freezer. Now I can cocking (reloading) it while squirrel hunting making it more difficult to keep from being noticed, this is where a PCP will be nice. You just need this and you can fill your scuba of a house compressor. They use them at the paintball fields. www.directindustry.com/prod/maximator-gmbh/product-15894-556677.html
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Post by tenring on May 27, 2016 6:12:20 GMT -5
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