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Post by Woody Williams on Jul 26, 2014 8:10:25 GMT -5
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Post by dbd870 on Jul 26, 2014 9:21:55 GMT -5
Between the article and the comments they about covered it. Never had a 16GA but I sure miss the days of birds and hunting with my 12 GA Ithaca 51 and it's IC choke.
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Post by steve46511 on Jul 26, 2014 10:57:00 GMT -5
One cannot help but fully agree with the reasons that are unfortunately accurate in the article, but I don't think the 16 will ever die. New guns are still coming out in this gauge. That said, if I was "flush" a 16ga side by side would still be on my "bucket list" to fill and soon. The mentioned Merkel 1620 and the Ugartechea doubles and especially the Ugartechea made special builds for Aspen Outfitting ( www.sidebysideshotgun.com/aoc-sg_boxlock.html ) are about as "classic" a double gun as ever existed. Being in a 16ga wouldn't give me any reason to pause if I was able to buy right now. The side by side boxlock, double triggers, English stock 16ga, IC/Mod chokes has been one of the top contenders for the "perfect upland gun" in many circles and across the pond such is not even rare, at least according to what I have seen posted in forums there. I have to say I found the auto safety on their specials to be a surprise as well as ejectors vs extractors....just my opinion. The "either or" option on Beretta's 486 is a feature I wish more had with a switch on the forend to choose extractor or ejector mode. One of my all time favorites that never seemed to find it's way to my gun cabinet due to raising a family or other issues is the Bill Hanus, Ugartechea import that can still be found half reasonable. They have been around awhile and I've yet to see an ugly one. www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=431273164SHOULD one bite that classic bullet buying a 16ga and wish to take it waterfowling, RIO mfg has came to bat with, new for 2014, 16 ga Bismuth shotshells. While I've little issue with steel shot simply used for the ranges it is effective (like any projectile) I might flinch a LITTLE shooting steel from a FINE side by side.  www.rioammo.com/rio_bismuth.htmlRST and I THINK, Polywad (going by what I was told by a gun writer and NOT by their website) both offer rounds loaded to spec for whatever you wish and really??? I didn't think the prices were all that horrible knowing how long a CASE would last me in the field should I decide to buy new shells and not load my own. RST even has spreader and low pressure rounds for some of the fine, OLD true classic double shotguns that one still wants to take along to let them do what they were built for.......and do so in style. The good Lord willing and things don't go from bad to worse.......I'll own a 16ga double someday. For loading there are companies selling new hulls and components for loading your own and, for me at least, some reloads are always part of my shooting. While factory rounds are available, even in bismuth, reloading is still another way to put part of oneself into the hunt in a more complete way and has always been "part of the hunt" to me and I enjoy it immensely. No, I personally, do NOT think the 16ga is the "most versatile" shell. That simply has no bearing on my desire to want one at all. I mention "most versatile" with tongue in cheek. Should the shooting public ONLY buy "the gauge that does the most things".........no one would every buy a 28ga or 410 (that always cost more and are always in demand). The 16ga falls in the same category, which is "because I want one" and it does not need to do anything "better" than anything else. To ME at least comments like "a 3 inch 20 gauge is more versatile" has zero value yet to some this seems to be a deal breaker on the 16ga. More often than not I've bought shotguns that I liked and if it was a different gauge, I'd still like it, still buy it, and just use it to it's (and my) limitations. I just want one.  My biggest problem with a 16 gauge.....is which one would I buy?  God Bless www.rioammo.com/rio_bismuth.html |
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Post by gumbootbill on Jul 26, 2014 19:03:33 GMT -5
I have 3 16 gauge shotguns, A Mossburg bolt action 3 shot poly choke.
A Stevens 311 side by side.
And a Browning A-5 I always liked the 16.
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Post by drs on Jul 27, 2014 4:45:56 GMT -5
My Grandfather always used a 16 gauge for hunting Squirrels & Rabbits. He used an old Springfield Model 1929 Single barrel with 30" barrel always worked well for him. My Father bought him an Ithaca Model 37, but my Grandfather couldn't shoot as well with it as with his old Springfield.
I think the reason the 16 gauge is dying is due to the fact one can buy 2 3/4" 12 or 3" 20 gauges loads, which pretty much duplicates the old 16 gauge.
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Post by steve46511 on Jul 27, 2014 7:30:59 GMT -5
My Grandfather always used a 16 gauge for hunting Squirrels & Rabbits. He used an old Springfield Model 1929 Single barrel with 30" barrel always worked well for him. My Father bought him an Ithaca Model 37, but my Grandfather couldn't shoot as well with it as with his old Springfield. I think the reason the 16 gauge is dying is due to the fact one can buy 2 3/4" 12 or 3" 20 gauges loads, which pretty much duplicates the old 16 gauge. This is how the mfg companies have set it up and advertised it......and it is accurate. However both the 12 and the 16 gauge can be loaded to anything ever shot in the 3 or 2 3/4 inch 20 gauge.......with a much shorter shot string and the 12 gauge could ALWAYS, since the 16 came out, duplicate the 16 ga loads. The 16 still existed for several decades. The 20 being able to duplicate either, albeit in a lessor manner, I don't feel effected much of anything. It was what manufacturers wanted to make. It would seem, that a longer, same diameter case would be less costly than continuing special work to create the 16 hulls in between the 20 and 12 so IMHO, they simply made fewer (some don't make any) 16s but advertised you could duplicate it with a 3 inch 20......but so what? I could always duplicate the 16 and the 20 with a standard 12 gauge. I see it more as a cost efficiency move on the manufacturers side of the picture but I'm also sure there are factors none of us know about. The ending result of what most shoot is a product of what the manufacturers advertised and what they loaded to sell. With thousands and thousands of 16ga guns STILL marketed and on gunbroker daily, it wasn't because few wanted a 16 ga......or don't LOOK like it anyway. Im not at all saying that the 20 in a 3 inch cant shoot heavier charges, it can, but the bigger bores will duplicate the load and shoot a better pattern with it and had ALREADY been doing so SOME of the old 12s were heavy beasts but today, some of the 12 ga guns are lighter than I would prefer for extended shooting and a 3 inch 20 will recoil similarly with the same shot charge and same gun weight. JUST my opinion, but I've never understood what "advantage" a 3 inch 20 gauge was when it's only attempting to duplicate charges already in existence and had been for decades in 12 ga an even some 16 ga shells. The manufacturing world tells us stories about why premium shot and why steel shot and why buffered loads too improved patterns with shorter shot strings........yet they made a 3 inch 20 gauge that by default, shoots a longer shot string than any like charge in the bigger bores. Nothing "wrong" with a 3 inch 20 but I've seen no examples, none. of it being any kind of improvement over what already existed. The 3 inch 12 gauge was similar but with FEW 10 gauge guns around in use anyway, they made a market for many who would not otherwise shoot such because they had to buy a 10 gauge gun and lug it around previously to do so. Everyone decides on their own about any personal "need" for 3 or 3 and 1/2 inches, HOPEFULLY based on their abilities and not on something dreamed up in advertisements. We seem to look down our noses at rifle rounds created "because it just duplicates such and such round and is no advantage" yet in the 3" shot shell exactly the opposite opinion occurred because........ That's what manufacturers told us to get us to buy them. "It duplicates an existing round" and its the factory ammo that rules what people buy. A buddy told me that he can shoot 3/4 oz to 1.5 oz shot charges in his 20 gauge for 3 inch shells.....my reply was "I've been doing that in my 12 gauge 2 3/4 for almost 40 years". I LIKE a 20 gauge gun, just for the sleeker profile in most doubles and even some repeaters but I don't and have no need nor desire to shoot 12 or 16 gauge loads in one. I absolutely LOVE a 28 gauge, but 3/4 ounce shot charges are ALL I shoot in one in the field or on the range. The 12s and 16s with identical heavy (for a 20 gauge load) shot charge amounts will shoot better patterns on moving game than the 20 gauge similarly loaded with that same heavy charge. No special shot needed. 2 cents, ONLY and as always. God Bless |
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Post by jackryan on Jul 27, 2014 12:15:24 GMT -5
If they started selling 16 gauge shells cheaper than 20 or 12, then 16 gauge guns would start flying off the shelves. They don't, in fact like the 410, they cost more. So they won't.
If you LIKE the 16, the thing to do is take advantage of the situation and enjoy the lower demand for the guns and use the savings to buy a reloader. Win win win. You can reload any kind of amo you want. Reloading is a little cheaper than buying amo and reloading 16 gauge is a whole lot cheaper than buying it.
All the same can be said of the 410 except for the cost of use guns, they are completely off the charts of reason.
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Post by steve46511 on Aug 5, 2014 6:16:18 GMT -5
One of the questions I've seen posted is one that can make one's wheels turn is this "What would we be shooting most of the time now if the manufacturers had gotten together years ago and decided to start making JUST the 16ga in 3 inch versions and not the 20 and the 12 gauges?" That didn't and could not happen simply because they could possibly sell less firearms since a "one size fits all" gun just doesn't quite do that as well as two versions with a little wider range of gun weights and shot charges. It would have been interesting though to see the results decades down the line. The 16 hasn't died but it has indeed fallen from grace for the average Joe who wish to buy one or two of the mass produced shotguns to hunt everything from rabbits to deer. However, if you look, and consider or are interested in higher end double guns like the CSMC RBL's and the Ugartechea made AOC/SG guns special ordered by Jon Hollinger and his Aspen Outfitting company where classic upland guns are the single goal........the 16 gauge is alive and well. www.aspenoutfitting.com/shotgunsales.htmThankfully, our opinions continue to vary concerning preferences of firearms and everything involved. I for one would particularly dislike it if everyone shot the exact same gun.  God Bless! |
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Post by sakorifle on Aug 6, 2014 19:44:29 GMT -5
greetings
The 16 gauge has not been that popular over here but it still seems to survive, british shell manufacturers still cater for it and just as well because i shoot two english 16 gauge side by side guns, one non ejector i use when in a hide and an ejector gun when i am shooting driven partridge and pheasants when they are coming thick and fast.
It does everything my 12 gauge does and it is lighter,
Anyone looking for an english gun the 16 gauge can be found somewhat cheaper than a twelve and a lot cheaper than a 20.
i also use a nice scottish 20 gauge for partridges sometimes.
regards
Billy
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Post by mossberg500 on Aug 12, 2014 17:08:56 GMT -5
I own 3 - 16 Gauge shotguns and I love using them more then my Mossberg 500 12 Ga
Winchester model 1200 pump with poly choke and an extra Full choke barrel
Savage model 220 single shot
Sears and Co. model 20 pump
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Post by sakorifle on Sept 1, 2014 21:04:18 GMT -5
well 1st september duck season opens over here, and where do you think my 16 gauge has been tonight, got one high shot in a barley field and the old gun connected, duck down, going to have to switch the oven on yum yum,
16 gauge is alive and kicking lol.
regards
Billy
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Post by Boilermaker on Sept 2, 2014 8:47:42 GMT -5
I'll be taking a recently acquired A-5 Sweet Sixteen round knob to Winner, S.D. in about a month and a half. I've never owned a 16 until now, but the anticipation of taking a South Dakota rooster with a classic shotgun is killing me!
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Post by sakorifle on Nov 14, 2014 17:18:05 GMT -5
greetings
Well boilermaker i seen your post of your pheasant shoot, looked like you all had fun, i take it those birds are wild?, over here most are breed for shooting.
i am off to the Midlands in December driven pheasant shooting and my 16 will be going.
But my question, now you have used your 16 hunting , did you enjoy using it?
Big question, would you go back to a twelve or is that now your gun of choice for bird hunting?
i personally prefer the 16, mostly because the english ones are lighter than a twelve, years gone by they used to be called a ladies gun, and some of the finest shots were ladies with there 16 bores, until it became unfashionable for ladies to shoot game.
regards
Billy
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Post by Boilermaker on Nov 14, 2014 19:47:05 GMT -5
Billy, I thoroughly enjoyed the 16 and will be taking it for each and every pheasant hunt I go to from now on. Like they say, carries like a 20 but hits like a 12. It's my new favorite shotgun.
My brother also took his and had great success as well.
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Post by firstwd on Nov 14, 2014 21:37:52 GMT -5
I guess I'm gonna have to dig mine out of the cabinet and see how it shoots.....
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Post by chriskline on Dec 4, 2014 13:36:44 GMT -5
My dad gave me one of his Ithaca 37 Featherlights.... man i love that gun.... now i just need to talk him out of his sweet 16 too |
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Post by single_shooter on Jan 7, 2015 21:27:38 GMT -5
I have an antique Savage Fox-B 16ga. side by side I got for the wife because someone has shortened the stock and it fit her like it was made for her.
i always pay way less for my 16ga shells - wait until late winter just before Spring...many stores discount them out because they didn't sell many...or any at all. The last time (1999) I got 8 cases at Wal-Mart for $2.50 a box for 6 and 7-1/2 shot. Still shooting those shells!!
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