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Post by greghopper on Mar 29, 2014 23:27:18 GMT -5
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 30, 2014 14:02:00 GMT -5
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Post by dominator on Mar 30, 2014 16:35:44 GMT -5
when CWD has been shown to be spontaneous then you can never completely prevent it
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 30, 2014 18:14:33 GMT -5
when CWD has been shown to be spontaneous then you can never completely prevent it I'm not up on all that, but where did that happen?
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 30, 2014 18:34:54 GMT -5
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Post by tenring on Mar 30, 2014 18:39:15 GMT -5
when CWD has been shown to be spontaneous then you can never completely prevent it I'm not up on all that, but where did that happen? Been around for long time, can't recall any mention of that happening.
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Post by dominator on Mar 30, 2014 22:23:54 GMT -5
'It may be possible that CWD is a spontaneous TSE that arose in deer in the wild or in captivity and has biological features promoting transmission to other deer and elk. The majority of human CJD cases are thought to be spontaneous and associated with conformational change in a normal cellular protein (PrPC) to the abnormal disease associated protease resistant protein (PrPres) considered by many to be infectious agents of the TSEs. Occurrence of spontaneous CJD is approximately 1 per 1 million population per year. Spontaneous CWD may have happened in deer though it is difficult to see how this could be proven." www.cwd-info.org/index.php/fuseaction/about.overviewthere is also some thought that repeated head trauma or brain abscesses in bucks may also contribute to the spontaneous thoery.
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Post by windingwinds on Mar 31, 2014 6:15:41 GMT -5
It is more likely that feed source, similar to mad cow disease is responsible for spread of cwd. Then shove the deer together in a farm, questionable high protein feed, it's not hard to see how it's likely spread. I hope Indiana continues to ban canned hunting. And we all need to support term limits for government officials, Bill Friend should have been retired a long time ago.
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Post by tenring on Mar 31, 2014 7:12:23 GMT -5
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Post by span870 on Mar 31, 2014 9:09:00 GMT -5
What I'm getting here is no one is sure how it has spread on even began. Question I always wondered is has it ever been proven 100% of a confirmed wild deer where it came from. Traced back to a specific source? With the amount of feed and seed being put out for supplemental feeding I see as a more likely source. Look at all the dog food and treats that have been recalled in the past years that have killed dogs and it will shock you. Most feed has ground up bones and meat in it from questionable sources. Doesn't it make more sense that this would have a more wide spread impact than an escaped deer here and there?
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Post by daneowner on Mar 31, 2014 9:43:54 GMT -5
ANTLER RELIGION! The June issue of Deer & Deer Hunting has an article with this title. Makes one wonder what will happen to our wildlife resource in the future.
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 31, 2014 10:00:16 GMT -5
'It may be possible that CWD is a spontaneous TSE that arose in deer in the wild or in captivity and has biological features promoting transmission to other deer and elk. The majority of human CJD cases are thought to be spontaneous and associated with conformational change in a normal cellular protein (PrPC) to the abnormal disease associated protease resistant protein (PrPres) considered by many to be infectious agents of the TSEs. Occurrence of spontaneous CJD is approximately 1 per 1 million population per year. Spontaneous CWD may have happened in deer though it is difficult to see how this could be proven." www.cwd-info.org/index.php/fuseaction/about.overviewthere is also some thought that repeated head trauma or brain abscesses in bucks may also contribute to the spontaneous thoery. Key word is MAY....
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Post by span870 on Mar 31, 2014 11:55:14 GMT -5
'It may be possible that CWD is a spontaneous TSE that arose in deer in the wild or in captivity and has biological features promoting transmission to other deer and elk. The majority of human CJD cases are thought to be spontaneous and associated with conformational change in a normal cellular protein (PrPC) to the abnormal disease associated protease resistant protein (PrPres) considered by many to be infectious agents of the TSEs. Occurrence of spontaneous CJD is approximately 1 per 1 million population per year. Spontaneous CWD may have happened in deer though it is difficult to see how this could be proven." www.cwd-info.org/index.php/fuseaction/about.overviewthere is also some thought that repeated head trauma or brain abscesses in bucks may also contribute to the spontaneous thoery. Key word is MAY.... And it MAY come from captive breeding. All everyone including biologist are doing is speculating. The problem I see is we most likely never will know what or where it started. Even if all deer farms were put out of business and its still around guys will still say look what those deer farms did. Who's to say captive herds didn't catch it from interacting with wild herds? So we put many farms out of business on a speculation.
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 31, 2014 17:23:47 GMT -5
And it MAY come from captive breeding. All everyone including biologist are doing is speculating. The problem I see is we most likely never will know what or where it started. Even if all deer farms were put out of business and its still around guys will still say look what those deer farms did. Who's to say captive herds didn't catch it from interacting with wild herds? So we put many farms out of business on a speculation. No MAY to it. It is pretty well a consensus by pros and cons on this subject that CWD started in a Colorado Government facility where deer were put into an enclosure were sheep that had Scrapies had been kept. I'm doing my best to keep the members here informed about this very touchy subject. About the only thing I have put forth myself is that "every Indiana politician should read this story before voting on any deer farm laws". The people that know me know I want the decision makers to gather all the facts before making any decision - pro or con. That is true of politicians, the NRC and the DNR. But, because I sent an email from here to inform the members of the Indy Star article I caught Holy heck from one member. He didn't think I should let everyone know about the article, but he had no qualms about asking me earlier to send a mass email supporting his agenda on rabbit hunting. I asked him to point out in that email where I asked any member to take a side one way or another.. he couldn't as I didn't. No matter as I'm sure he is now contacting like thinking folks to register on here and give me more Holy heck.
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Post by span870 on Mar 31, 2014 18:18:29 GMT -5
Woody... I think you took my post completely wrong. I don't have a stake in either side of the issue. I accept your stance on it and your right to say it. I believe you have every right to state your opinion on the subject to the Star and quite honestly if you want to email whomever you want to I don't see what's its anyone's right to say you can't or complain about you doing it. Your page allows a more diverse opinion than others. So I apologize if you took my post as jumping on you.
My stance has been that I have never seen concrete proof in my eyes of what causes the spread of it. Yes I would agree where it started but how it spread beyond there has not been proven to me. I don't think the captive breeding of deer in a controlled environment is bad. I know deer farmers, one that sells his deer to an individual that has put a massive black eye on the practice. These deer are extensively tested and he has never had a deer test positive. Some of his deer are worth well into 6 figures. One approaching 7. These deer are taken care of and tested way more than any cattle you would put on your plate. Do we punish all farmers for this practice or put stricter controls on them. Some hunters poach deer. Do we punish all? Take the time to visit a deer farm that raises the quality of deer that sell for 20 30 40 thousand and you will see this isn't something they take lightly. 1 positive test and they will lose everything.
Again I'm sorry if you thought this was more than just someone stating their opinion. Nothing more and nothing less.
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 31, 2014 18:32:34 GMT -5
Are you talking about a test for CWD? There is no live test as of yet. The animal has to be dead and a portion of the deer's brain is examined. Your friend can test for a bunch of other diseases but unless he kills the deer he will never know it has CWD until it starts showing signs.
span870,
It is not just about CWD, it is also about Bovine TB. One such Indiana "hunting facility" had cases of bovine TB and had to be depopulated at the tax payers (US) expense.
Oh, I think in the end the deer farmers and shooting pens will get their way but will have to agree to very heavy regulation. There is way too much money to be made to go away quietly.
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Post by steve46511 on Apr 1, 2014 4:52:48 GMT -5
Are you talking about a test for CWD? There is no live test as of yet. The animal has to be dead and a portion of the deer's brain is examined. Your friend can test for a bunch of other diseases but unless he kills the deer he will never know it has CWD until it starts showing signs. span870, It is not just about CWD, it is also about Bovine TB. One such Indiana "hunting facility" had cases of bovine TB and had to be depopulated at the tax payers (US) expense. Oh, I think in the end the deer farmers and shooting pens will get their way but will have to agree to very heavy regulation. There is way too much money to be made to go away quietly. Unfortunately......such is so true, in so many things.........IMHO. God bless
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Post by jjas on Apr 1, 2014 7:55:00 GMT -5
Woody Williams
I think you're exactly right. Agree with it or not, there's a market for these types of places and it's all tied into our obsession with trophy bucks. And while I agree that there will be heavy regulation on paper, how well those regulations are enforced may prove to be "interesting".
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Post by Woody Williams on Apr 1, 2014 7:59:51 GMT -5
Woody Williams I think you're exactly right. Agree with it or not, there's a market for these types of places and it's all tied into our obsession with trophy bucks. And while I agree that there will be heavy regulation on paper, how well those regulations are enforced may prove to be "interesting". Depends on who does the enforcing - BOAH or the DNR .
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Post by greghopper on Apr 1, 2014 11:58:37 GMT -5
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