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Post by throbak on Jan 2, 2014 21:44:29 GMT -5
Switzerland Co. Conservation Club in Bennington In. has a range that goes to 500yds FYI
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Post by tenring on Jan 2, 2014 23:17:42 GMT -5
It took 20 years to get the PCR into the regulations, but someone slipped in with their eraser and bottle necks got legal. Who did it?
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Post by drs on Jan 3, 2014 5:24:59 GMT -5
It took 20 years to get the PCR into the regulations, but someone slipped in with their eraser and bottle necks got legal. Who did it? Back in 1987, I petitioned the IDNR to consider legalizing the use of Pistol cartridges, which fired cartridges like .357 Magnum, .44 Magnum, and .45 Long Colt, out of a rifle. This idea came about by the fact that the then new Sabot shotgun loads, fired from rifled barrels, were similar in range & performance to Pistol cartridges listed above, as are M/L's that also fire saboted pistol bullets. This was before I even had a computer to do additional research, so my communications with the State was either by phone calls or letters, with charts and tables showing the similarities of the two types (Pistol & Sabot shotgun loads). Years later, I received a letter from the State saying that they were going to examine my proposal and only then would they make a decision. I also pointed out that not only were Pistol Cartridges cheaper than Sabot Shotgun Loads and had less recoil, with the same or similar ballistics. So long story short, in 2007 the State legalized PCRs for hunting Deer. I am uncertain who or what group found a loophole in that they could form legal wildcat cartridges, based on length of cartridge case length. Some of those wildcat cartridges sound neat, and are good cartridges like the .358 Hoosier, one of the most interesting one.
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Post by swilk on Jan 3, 2014 6:20:38 GMT -5
There is no loophole.
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Post by fireater34 on Jan 3, 2014 8:06:04 GMT -5
One of my main concerns with opening up carte blanche with alot of the common 30 cal rifles is the same thing we have seen for years with the shot guns and muzzle loaders as well. Goto walmart the day / night before opening season.. How many people that are in there buying up guns and ammo and going on about heading into the woods first thing in the morning. Bad enough having guys running around out there with guns that aren't sighted in what so ever. really want someone throwing around .308's that have no idea what they are doing.. much less with a high power that's not sighted in? My 358 Hoosier is plenty enough for any hunting in indiana, especially when talking ranged shooting, still most deer i have shot the past several years were mostly well within shotgun range or some of the smaller "cowboy calibers". I did shoot a few deer this year right at the 300yd +/- realm. For majority of any hunting in Indiana there is no realistic need for going out with my .308. yes I have used my .308 for deer and shot several deer at 800-1,000yds (clean kills). However that was in remote areas of south texas in settings appropriate for doing that kind of shooting.
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Post by tenring on Jan 3, 2014 8:22:41 GMT -5
True, just some back room BS.
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Post by Woody Williams on Jan 3, 2014 8:47:05 GMT -5
True, just some back room BS. Not sure where and how "straight wall" got dropped but I really don't have a problem with the end result. I do know that the DNR issues it's preliminary proposal and then asks fir public input. As we all know that public input can drastically change the final proposal..
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Post by chriskline on Jan 3, 2014 8:58:38 GMT -5
u can hunt anything with a center fire rifle in Indiana,except deer. ^^^^this
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Post by tenring on Jan 3, 2014 18:40:38 GMT -5
Lordy, here we go again.
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Post by lugnutz on Jan 4, 2014 16:24:06 GMT -5
I'd have to disagree, the wildcats wasn't considered when the DNR put PCRs into law. Comparing a wildcat to a PCR is like comparing smokless muzzys to traditional muzzys, or traditional long bows to compounds. Hunters taking advantage of the laws, i'd call that a loop hole.
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Post by swilk on Jan 4, 2014 16:53:10 GMT -5
Wildcats are specifically mentioned in the rule.
Have been since the first day the law was put on the books.
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Post by Woody Williams on Jan 4, 2014 16:57:02 GMT -5
I'd have to disagree, the wildcats wasn't considered when the DNR put PCRs into law. Comparing a wildcat to a PCR is like comparing smokless muzzys to traditional muzzys, or traditional long bows to compounds. Hunters taking advantage of the laws, i'd call that a loop hole. My belief is there are several "wild catters" that work at the DNR. They knew exactly what they were doing just like when they changed what cartridges could be used in handguns.. No "loophole" or they would have stuck with straight walled..
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Post by M4Madness on Jan 4, 2014 17:28:55 GMT -5
I'd have to disagree, the wildcats wasn't considered when the DNR put PCRs into law. Comparing a wildcat to a PCR is like comparing smokless muzzys to traditional muzzys, or traditional long bows to compounds. Hunters taking advantage of the laws, i'd call that a loop hole. I have the entire 162-page PDF file from the NRC covering this issue, and on page 162 it is plainly stated: They were fully aware of the possibility of wildcats and welcomed them.
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Post by parson on Jan 5, 2014 8:32:31 GMT -5
Nobody needs rifle bigger than _________! (fill in the blank based on personal opinion.)
I remember the meetings when PCR's were being debated, and heated statements that "30 round clips" were going to make the woodlands (and surrounding areas) unsafe!
Funny, now some of the most vocal opponents are now using wildcats. And, the slaughter rate of hunters and farmers has not exploded.
For decades, the warning on .22 rimfire boxes has stated that are are dangerous for up to a mile. Might be a good thing that are being priced out of reach.
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Post by Woody Williams on Jan 5, 2014 10:43:20 GMT -5
Nobody needs rifle bigger than _________! (fill in the blank based on personal opinion.) I remember the meetings when PCR's were being debated, and heated statements that "30 round clips" were going to make the woodlands (and surrounding areas) unsafe! Funny, now some of the most vocal opponents are now using wildcats. And, the slaughter rate of hunters and farmers has not exploded. For decades, the warning on .22 rimfire boxes has stated that are are dangerous for up to a mile. Might be a good thing that are being priced out of reach. I remember it well... Any supporters were brandef as "John Wayne wannabes".
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Post by tenring on Jan 5, 2014 10:49:03 GMT -5
Wildcats are specifically mentioned in the rule. Have been since the first day the law was put on the books. But who was responsible for the original proposal being changed? Maybe Kyle ?
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Post by drs on Jan 5, 2014 11:00:04 GMT -5
Nobody needs rifle bigger than _________! (fill in the blank based on personal opinion.) I remember the meetings when PCR's were being debated, and heated statements that "30 round clips" were going to make the woodlands (and surrounding areas) unsafe! Funny, now some of the most vocal opponents are now using wildcats. And, the slaughter rate of hunters and farmers has not exploded. For decades, the warning on .22 rimfire boxes has stated that are are dangerous for up to a mile. Might be a good thing that are being priced out of reach. I remember it well... Any supporters were brandef as "John Wayne wannabes". Or "Lucas McCain"
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Post by Woody Williams on Jan 5, 2014 12:20:44 GMT -5
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Post by Woody Williams on Jan 5, 2014 12:21:55 GMT -5
Wildcats are specifically mentioned in the rule. Have been since the first day the law was put on the books. But who was responsible for the original proposal being changed? Maybe Kyle ? Dunno....
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Post by holyland on Jan 16, 2014 0:46:18 GMT -5
Indiana Hunting Regulations can be frustrating at times when you want to go hunting with a more common rifle caliber. I want to have the law updated so we can use a broader range of calibers. Hunting white tail deer all 30 caliber rifles should be legalized in Indiana. These modern 30 caliber cartridges are used nationwide year round for hunting, target practice and other activities. People are limited on how they are able to hunt with the way the law is now; we are not able to use our Grandpa’s old 3030 rifle or any other modern rifle because of the current law. 30 caliber riffles are used in a lot of states for hunting deer and I believe Indiana should allow us to have the same option. I feel it’s a shame that many people who move to Indiana and have more common caliber rifles are forbidden to use them for hunting and can only find themselves with the choice of shots guns or the limited selection listed in the DNR book. It can cost more than most people have to build a gun around the offered legal calibers. One gentleman said, “My dad has hunted with a shotgun his whole life, and the recoil is getting painful in his older age. I would love to let him borrow my rifle that has much less recoil, because I am not able to afford to buy him a new one that happens to fit inside Indiana’s narrow caliber rules”. Indiana ground isn’t flat like a lot of people say, we have hills which would be backstops for the bullets and people in tree stands don’t fire up in the air and their backstop is the ground. Hunters on the ground position themselves near a deer trail so that they can find a deer in a controlled space so when they shoot they have a backstop so the bullet will be limited on travel and won’t hit anyone. As far as the arguments against using modern cartridges, any bullet is lethal. Any hunter shooting without being certain what is beyond the deer is being reckless. Hunter education covers this safety issues during class, because I know they Iron in to the minds of every student the, "Ten Commandments of Hunting Safety". My argument for legalizing modern rifle calibers would be: *Greater accuracy so you will have a cleaner kill. The animal will suffer less, and you will have less wounded deers running away only to have the hunter not retrieve the injured deer and shoot another. The hunter would have more control of his shot placement limiting damage to the deer’s vital organs. *More people own the more common calibers, so you may have more people take up an interest in hunting, selling more licenses and rifles in Indiana increasing Indiana's revenue. *Hunters from out of state can hunt here since the rifle's they already own can be used also increasing Indiana's revenue by selling the higher priced out of state licenses. *Most modern rifle calibers have lower recoil than a shotgun, allowing older hunters to hunt longer. It may also reduce injuries of people falling out of stands due to the heavier recoil knocking them off balance in a tree stand. Please sign my petition. If you have any comments please feel free to add them. Thank you. www.ipetitions.com/petition/indiana-hunting-rifle-cartridge-change/
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