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Post by old3arrows on Dec 19, 2010 9:04:10 GMT -5
OK a friend talked me in to buying a used Savage ML-II. I've bee doing a lot of research on loads and powder and plan on working up a smokeless load. He was hunting this weekend with his ML-II and went to discharge it after hunting and had what he called a weak or squib discharge. The primer, Win 209, sounded normal, but the bullet and sabot only made it out of the muzzle about 25 feet. Now my questions are, did he have the bullet firmly seated on the powder, because smokeless requires compression to fire properly. Or did the powder draw moisture from hot/cold bringing it in and out of the house while hunting. You know how bad a gun sweats when you are hunting in these kind of temps and bring it in from the cold, and could this have affected the powder. I try to leave my gun in the vehicle and cased if I am hunting multiple days in a year. If it is a blackpowder gun, it stays loaded, and uncapped of course, until I fire the gun or the season ends. Now I loaded my Knight with two, 50 grain, pyrodex pellets, and a 250 grain Barnes Expander on the first day of the season. We had some bitterly low temps this season, and I had to bring the gun in out of the clod for a week, still cased. Before hunting, I checked the gun for rust and corrosion around the nipple and breech plug area. On my short hunt, the gun was only uncased for about an hour before I put a #11 cap on the nipple and cleanly killed a doe with no issues. So back to the smokeless powder issue, has anyone had problems with a Savage drawing moisture and causing poor ignition or no ignition?
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Post by esshup on Dec 19, 2010 9:47:49 GMT -5
I've never had that problem, although when I had to push out a load last week, the part of bullet that wasn't incased in the sabot was discolored from oxidation.
What powder/sabot/bullet was he shooting?
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Post by old3arrows on Dec 19, 2010 10:16:01 GMT -5
45 grains of 5744 and 295 grain green power belt
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Post by Decatur on Dec 19, 2010 10:30:02 GMT -5
I leave mine loaded, uncapped, and in the garage just to make sure it doesn't happen.
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Post by esshup on Dec 19, 2010 12:36:19 GMT -5
It might be the powerbelt. I don't know if they consistently have enough resistance to light 5744.
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Post by gobblerstopper on Dec 19, 2010 12:39:40 GMT -5
I've never had a problem with mine shooting, when it was loaded  I don't know about the powerbelts, but I know the bullets I shoot load very easily and I will be changing bullets and loads because of that. I've never had a problem with any of my other "smokeless" guns from taking them in and out of the house either. I'm not sure why the muzzleloader would be different. |
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Post by swilk on Dec 19, 2010 13:25:46 GMT -5
dont use powerbelt bullets in a Savage when using smokeless powder. Ever.
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Post by old3arrows on Dec 19, 2010 13:45:45 GMT -5
Swilk can you give me any more insight or documentation, so I can pass it on to this guy! He can be a knucklehead at times!
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Post by swilk on Dec 19, 2010 14:05:16 GMT -5
The savage relies on the friction of the bullet/sabot during the ignition process .... the powerbelt line of bullets just dont have the grip to stay seated while the powder is ignited. Spend a day reading at this site .... everything a person needs to know about the Savage and more. dougsmessageboards.proboards.com/index.cgiBasically the tighter the bullet/sabot the better .... within reason. A guy might get ignition while using a powerbelt some of the time but sooner or later it will fail. Savage shooters play around with more sabots than any other shooters I have ever seen .... they basically try every combination of bullet/sabot you can imagine to find a happy point of ignition and accuracy. If a person doesnt want to do all that playing around themselves there are certain "go to" combinations that have been proven by multiple shooters. Personally I shoot a black crush rib sabot by harvester and use a .458 barnes bullet. It is very hard to seat the bullet but it goes bang each and every time. I have also used black MMP sabots and a .452 xtp bullet with good results. |
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Post by Decatur on Dec 19, 2010 18:09:13 GMT -5
I have good luck with the black MMP sabots.
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Post by hankhunter on Dec 19, 2010 19:02:19 GMT -5
I've never heard any Savage people say a good word about powerbelts. I use Hornady High pressure sabots and have never had a missfire. I use SR 4759 but 5744 also lights easy. I bring my Savage in the house at the end of the day but I put it by a heat register for dry rapid heat. I only fire and reload in very wet conditions at the end of the day. Some people tape the end of the barrel in rainy conditions. I just carry the rifle muzzle down. This works for me. My guess is the power belts.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2010 19:15:11 GMT -5
I've left mine loaded for weeks and it still goes off. I agree, the problem is the Powerbelts. Also, don't use the yellow T/C sabots as they load "too easy" to provide ignition.
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Post by hornharvester on Dec 19, 2010 20:27:58 GMT -5
Powerbelts are a no-no in the Savage using smokeless powder. Don't use anything but saboted bullets in a .50 unless you know what you are doing. Tell him to get 300 XTP and MMP or Harvester short black sabots with the 5744. With this combo he shouldn't have any problem.
Come visit us at Dougs for all the info on Savages. h.h.
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Post by daworz on Dec 20, 2010 3:15:12 GMT -5
HH is Right Power-Belts Are a Big No, In Savage, He's Is also right about Dougs, even if you dont join you can get alot of Info there, fom guys that are just a shout away? Trust me, They helped me, and Iam shooting Lights Out.
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Post by old3arrows on Dec 26, 2010 19:32:41 GMT -5
You guys are a bad influence! Got the new BDC Leupold 3x9 scope mounted and just received $150 in bullets and sabots! All I need is a couple of pounds of powder, and I'm ready to start working up loads.
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Post by Decatur on Dec 26, 2010 20:19:13 GMT -5
;d
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Post by Gunsafe on Dec 19, 2011 20:02:58 GMT -5
NO Power belts in a savage, but do go and read on Doug's Message Board,that's where i got my start on savage information .... ''GREAT BUNCH OF PEOPLE.''
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Post by HuntMeister on Dec 19, 2011 20:07:42 GMT -5
another vote for Doug's message board...volumes of info there...
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Post by 629powerport on Dec 19, 2011 22:14:08 GMT -5
Savage SS 10ML-II 50 Cal. Hornady FTX 45cal. (.458”) 325gr. (Product SKU: 45015) MMP Orange HPH Sabot: Winchester W209 primer 44gr. of Accurate 5744 100 yards  |
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Post by lymanl3 on Dec 23, 2011 0:29:01 GMT -5
Nice. I cokdnt get the hornadys to shoot well with the black Sabot, but the barnes worked well over the orange one. Couldnt shoot the Vit powder with either bullet/sabot combo. Ended up with Hod and still tinkering but shooting good enough to hunt.
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I don't know about the powerbelts, but I know the bullets I shoot load very easily and I will be changing bullets and loads because of that.
